2013 XHP not supported - LETS MAKE IT HAPPEN!

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by sidewaysat11

Same thing with mine, about 7.5 minutes for the flash. It never asked anything about a back up.. Hoping it did.

It does, I just put mine back to stock (left the torque limiters off, gear indicator active, and adjusted max shift points on though) and it's shifting and driving just like it did stock, minus the DME pulling boost. I'll go back to stage 2 or 3 when I have time to reset the adaptations and relearn.

[Dawgz]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

It does, I just put mine back to stock (left the torque limiters off, gear indicator active, and adjusted max shift points on though) and it's shifting and driving just like it did stock, minus the DME pulling boost. I'll go back to stage 2 or 3 when I have time to reset the adaptations and relearn.

What made you revert?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Dawgz

What made you revert?

Even on Stage 1 the shifting was horrific. Nearly half-second pauses between gear shifts and when it did finally shift it was so ridiculous, the type of slamming of the gears that break parts.

If you scroll up and see the graphs I posted, you can see the huge delays in the G force and throttle plate closures, it feels like someone driving a manual, taking it out of gear when flooring it, waiting half a second, then slamming it into the next gear with their foot off the throttle, then flooring it again. Gives you whiplash. Normal driving under 1/3 throttle is just fine, gets progressively worse the faster you go.

Now I am not blaming XHP for this, I've got a 160K on this transmission and it has never shifted right since I bought it, replacing the solenoids and installing a Sonnax Zip kit helped make it livable. I was hoping XHP would help but I the reality is I will need to rebuild it to get the full potential of it.

I still have the software tweaks to the stock profile on it such as torque limiters removed and RPM shift limits, so that part was well worth the price alone.

I will try a complete adaptation reset and relearn with Stage 2 installed but not holding my breath it will help.

EDIT: Added the draggy image highlighting the 1-2 and 2-3 shift, Nearly a full second of near zero acceleration combined. This truck would be in the high 3.8-3.9 second time if the transmission were shifting properly.

[sidewaysat11]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

Even on Stage 1 the shifting was horrific. Nearly half-second pauses between gear shifts and when it did finally shift it was so ridiculous, the type of slamming of the gears that break parts.

If you scroll up and see the graphs I posted, you can see the huge delays in the G force and throttle plate closures, it feels like someone driving a manual, taking it out of gear when flooring it, waiting half a second, then slamming it into the next gear with their foot off the throttle, then flooring it again. Gives you whiplash. Normal driving under 1/3 throttle is just fine, gets progressively worse the faster you go.

Now I am not blaming XHP for this, I've got a 160K on this transmission and it has never shifted right since I bought it, replacing the solenoids and installing a Sonnax Zip kit helped make it livable. I was hoping XHP would help but I the reality is I will need to rebuild it to get the full potential of it.

I still have the software tweaks to the stock profile on it such as torque limiters removed and RPM shift limits, so that part was well worth the price alone.

I will try a complete adaptation reset and relearn with Stage 2 installed but not holding my breath it will help.

EDIT: Added the draggy image highlighting the 1-2 and 2-3 shift, Nearly a full second of near zero acceleration combined. This truck would be in the high 3.8-3.9 second time if the transmission were shifting properly.

Do you think resetting adaptation will help? Is there the potential that it would make things worse?
Even on stage 3 my shifting does not feel at all like you are stating.

[beetle6986]

Originally Posted by sidewaysat11

Do you think resetting adaptation will help? Is there the potential that it would make things worse?
Even on stage 3 my shifting does not feel at all like you are stating.

I've been running stage 3. Car is running great. Only slightly more aggressive in standard drive. It's much quicker in sport mode with solid shifts. Everything feels pretty good. Tune is going in next.

[sidewaysat11]

Originally Posted by beetle6986

I've been running stage 3. Car is running great. Only slightly more aggressive in standard drive. It's much quicker in sport mode with solid shifts. Everything feels pretty good. Tune is going in next.

Which tune are you going for?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by sidewaysat11

Do you think resetting adaptation will help? Is there the potential that it would make things worse?
Even on stage 3 my shifting does not feel at all like you are stating.

Doubt it will make it worse, most likely wont change anything, my gut tells me that there is just to much internal wear on the clutch pistons and a rebuild will be the only thing that fixes it, but its worth a shot. I reset thee adaptations about 15K ago when I replaced the solenoids and it made it driveable again as it was so bad before it felt like it was going to tear itself out of the truck on coasting down-shifts but the delay between shifts didn't change to much, was hoping XHP would help but made it more noticeable.

I wasn't super careful on the relearn procedure before and noticed my C clutch has a very low adaptation count after 15K miles. When I reset again I will be absolutely meticulous on the relearn. This will require long stretches of road with no traffic so going to have to do in the boonies around 2am and why I have not done it yet but will soon.

[beetle6986]

Originally Posted by sidewaysat11

Which tune are you going for?

ESS tuning.

[Dawgz]

@ Sophisticated Redneck

With the xhp are you able to set a higher trans torque limit rather than just removing it?

Does it show you the current limit it uses?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Dawgz

@ Sophisticated Redneck

With the xhp are you able to set a higher trans torque limit rather than just removing it?

Does it show you the current limit it uses?

Yep your can do either, remove it or set the torque limit per gear which is really cool. You can define the limit between 300-1200nm per gear.

Also since you have a M with the 6HP, they have a shiftmap editor which allows you to make your own shiftmaps! Wish they had that for the 8HP...

[Dawgz]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

Yep your can do either, remove it or set the torque limit per gear which is really cool. You can define the limit between 300-1200nm per gear.

Also since you have a M with the 6HP, they have a shiftmap editor which allows you to make your own shiftmaps! Wish they had that for the 8HP...

Nice, but does it show you the current torque values (per gear) that the TCU is using?

I feel like my TCU is not allowing the DME to go all out in lower gears, I have logs that show the trans torque value goes from 747 all the way to 100 while in WOT for brief seconds from 2-4K rpm

[Dawgz]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

Even on Stage 1 the shifting was horrific. Nearly half-second pauses between gear shifts and when it did finally shift it was so ridiculous, the type of slamming of the gears that break parts.

If you scroll up and see the graphs I posted, you can see the huge delays in the G force and throttle plate closures, it feels like someone driving a manual, taking it out of gear when flooring it, waiting half a second, then slamming it into the next gear with their foot off the throttle, then flooring it again. Gives you whiplash. Normal driving under 1/3 throttle is just fine, gets progressively worse the faster you go.

Now I am not blaming XHP for this, I've got a 160K on this transmission and it has never shifted right since I bought it, replacing the solenoids and installing a Sonnax Zip kit helped make it livable. I was hoping XHP would help but I the reality is I will need to rebuild it to get the full potential of it.

I still have the software tweaks to the stock profile on it such as torque limiters removed and RPM shift limits, so that part was well worth the price alone.

I will try a complete adaptation reset and relearn with Stage 2 installed but not holding my breath it will help.

EDIT: Added the draggy image highlighting the 1-2 and 2-3 shift, Nearly a full second of near zero acceleration combined. This truck would be in the high 3.8-3.9 second time if the transmission were shifting properly.

Btw I was reading up on this and it seems that they advise these harsh shifts and this kind of behavior could happen for the first x amount of miles.

Explained here..

https://www.darksidedevelopments.co....ission-tuning/




Q: I just flashed my transmission, but the shifts are bad.

A: Your transmission may behave weird, right after flash, e.g. starting in 3rd gear. This issue should clear within a few hundred meters of driving. The transmission has extensive adaption-algorithms, to keep shift quality in check over a full life time and even with heavily worn out clutches. The adaptions applied, are very sensitive to abrupt changes, as they operate in a narrow window. Therefore, shift quality can suffer in the first few hundred miles, after doing an oil-change, replacing transmission hardware, or changing the TCU software, like with xHP. Don’t over stress your transmission during this adaption phase. The best way to adapt your transmission, is just normal driving in D mode with lots of varying speeds and shifts. We DO NOT advise anybody to clear the adaption values to speed up the process. Depending on the current wear state of your transmission, this can lead to unwanted and permanent bad results.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Dawgz

Nice, but does it show you the current torque values (per gear) that the TCU is using?

I feel like my TCU is not allowing the DME to go all out in lower gears, I have logs that show the trans torque value goes from 747 all the way to 100 while in WOT for brief seconds from 2-4K rpm

It doesn't show you the torque settings unless you load turn on the torque limiting feature and set it at what you want. Otherwise the software just turns off all of the torque limits supposedly.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Dawgz

Btw I was reading up on this and it seems that they advise these harsh shifts and this kind of behavior could happen for the first x amount of miles.

Explained here..

https://www.darksidedevelopments.co....ission-tuning/




Q: I just flashed my transmission, but the shifts are bad.

A: Your transmission may behave weird, right after flash, e.g. starting in 3rd gear. This issue should clear within a few hundred meters of driving. The transmission has extensive adaption-algorithms, to keep shift quality in check over a full life time and even with heavily worn out clutches. The adaptions applied, are very sensitive to abrupt changes, as they operate in a narrow window. Therefore, shift quality can suffer in the first few hundred miles, after doing an oil-change, replacing transmission hardware, or changing the TCU software, like with xHP. Don’t over stress your transmission during this adaption phase. The best way to adapt your transmission, is just normal driving in D mode with lots of varying speeds and shifts. We DO NOT advise anybody to clear the adaption values to speed up the process. Depending on the current wear state of your transmission, this can lead to unwanted and permanent bad results.

Ya I read up on all of that, but after 1000 miles before I pulled the stage one off, it was clear it was not going to get any better. The adaptions counters were sky high and maybe another 2000-3000 miles of it shifting like hell and beating the crap out of the truck might have allowed it to even out, but not worth it. The way it shifted was brutal, even in stage 1 noway was I going to drive it any longer.

I am not blaming XHP for this, my transmission has had issues from the first day I got it, one of the reasons I got it so cheap. A byproduct of what I am sure its previous owner subjecting it to harsh daily driving stop and go traffic high temps and BMW's insane "lifetime oil" BS. When I changed the oil when I got it, it was black as night. Didn't help. Once I changed the solenoids and reset the adaptations, it was drivable again without issue however under heavy throttle, the shifts are still very slow, XHP did not fix this as I had hoped, only made it worse which tells me I will most likely have to rebuild the transmission so resetting the adaptations again with stage 2 loaded is a last ditch effort before I rebuild.

Slight possibly it could be issues with the MAF's and will explore that too before I rebuild, but all of that is taking a backseat for now until I get the intake finished.

[Dawgz]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

Ya I read up on all of that, but after 1000 miles before I pulled the stage one off, it was clear it was not going to get any better. The adaptions counters were sky high and maybe another 2000-3000 miles of it shifting like hell and beating the crap out of the truck might have allowed it to even out, but not worth it. The way it shifted was brutal, even in stage 1 noway was I going to drive it any longer.

I am not blaming XHP for this, my transmission has had issues from the first day I got it, one of the reasons I got it so cheap. A byproduct of what I am sure its previous owner subjecting it to harsh daily driving stop and go traffic high temps and BMW's insane "lifetime oil" BS. When I changed the oil when I got it, it was black as night. Didn't help. Once I changed the solenoids and reset the adaptations, it was drivable again without issue however under heavy throttle, the shifts are still very slow, XHP did not fix this as I had hoped, only made it worse which tells me I will most likely have to rebuild the transmission so resetting the adaptations again with stage 2 loaded is a last ditch effort before I rebuild.

Slight possibly it could be issues with the MAF's and will explore that too before I rebuild, but all of that is taking a backseat for now until I get the intake finished.

I see.

My trans also had issues when I got it, only with the reverse gear.

I had mine built by level 10, stronger clutches, high flow mechatronics and solenoids.

They sell kits also but I see that for the 8hp they only have clutches listed. They might have more that isn't updated on the site?


https://www.levelten.com/bmw_transmission_and_performance_parts_s/29.htm

[The Blimp]

I was keen to get this for my X6 35i but am in two minds now.

I spoke to xhp as to why the features for the X6 with the 8HP are much fewer than for other cars that use this trans such as the F10 535i and they said they just said they dont support them. You get those features if you code them yourself but the OTS will not have them.

The only features are removal of torque limits and slightly faster shifts in M and S modes in stage 3 - so maybe not worth the money.

What are the thoughts of those that have this on N55? Is it worth it?

I have MHD stage 1+ at the moment and shifts feel sluggish and letting the car down

[E30ROB]

I made a quick YouTube video of the clips I had of my 2013 35i with MHD stage 2+ E50 map and XHP stage 3.

Enjoy

[Dawgz]

Sophisticated Redneck

Here is a log I just took in third. From 3k to 3.5k rpm.

Boost: 14psi

Columns

AI : current calculated torque
AJ: DME torque target
AK: Trans torque limit

As you see when the DME starts setting higher torque limits the trans pulls back. @ 700 the trans sets it to 300, I can feel the car sort of pulling back.

[Dawgz]

Bought the license and map pack but can't figure out how to backup my stock map. Don't see any options

Update:

Got this back from their support team:

"
Hi,

there are no backups anymore. As we have all stock BMW files on our server. So if you flash STOCK with uninstall you will get a X5M BMW firmware.

Best Regards,
"

[nodemgr]

quick q, can the dealer see that this sw has been flashed? even if reverted to stock

[Dawgz]

Originally Posted by nodemgr

quick q, can the dealer see that this sw has been flashed? even if reverted to stock

There is usually a flash counter that increments everytime there is a flash done.

So if they really checked, ya they can tell.

[Dawgz]

Did the flash, had a short drive around town, I like the new shift points..didn't go hard on it yet though.

I like it. Will post additional comments as I drive it more.