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      11-20-2018, 01:09 PM   #1
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Downpipes and your CEL

I've read many things on downpipes and can see numerous solutions to ridding the annoying CEL that becomes a part of the territory with more engine modification.

My question:

Is there a way to add cat-less downpipes and have the CEL removed and have it in ready state so that emissions inspections can be successfully passed?

I've been told that some tunes will remove the CEL- but none describe that the ready state of the sensor will be available when OBD scanned for state inspections.

I'm currently STG1 BMS tune with a Fabspeed exhaust and looking to do DPs now but do not want to challenge the fact that I will have to remove DPs each time I go for a state inspection on the vehicle- just seems that will get very pricey!

Anybody want to teach me the right way to go about this?

Options I see:
  • High flow cat downpipes
  • Tune that removes CEL and sets ready state on sensor
  • O2 extenders- increases the space from gas flow to sensor

What is the secret to the sauce here?
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      11-20-2018, 04:47 PM   #2
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I don't understand your question.

Catalytic converters modify the exhaust stream, removing gases, pollutants and power.
Dropping the cats from your exhaust line-up will increase all of these, possibly causing your vehicle to fail to comply with local regulations for emissions.

Is your emission testing criteria based purely on whether your vehicle is throwing a code at the time of inspection or do they actually test content of exhaust gases?
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      11-20-2018, 05:24 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by protecon View Post
I don't understand your question.

Catalytic converters modify the exhaust stream, removing gases, pollutants and power.
Dropping the cats from your exhaust line-up will increase all of these, possibly causing your vehicle to fail to comply with local regulations for emissions.

Is your emission testing criteria based purely on whether your vehicle is throwing a code at the time of inspection or do they actually test content of exhaust gases?
Im no expert but they check codes in NC and I assume if one of the downstream o2 is triggered either by code or not in ready status, it fails.

This happened on my Raptor when I had tuned it and it turned off the downstream o2 for a more aggressive fuel mapping. And happened on my e46 when the MAF sensor was faulty and triggered a CEL it would fail state inspection.

So ultimately, how are all the modders here doing catless pipes and passing emissions inspections?
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      11-20-2018, 06:10 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncbimma View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by protecon View Post
I don't understand your question.

Catalytic converters modify the exhaust stream, removing gases, pollutants and power.
Dropping the cats from your exhaust line-up will increase all of these, possibly causing your vehicle to fail to comply with local regulations for emissions.

Is your emission testing criteria based purely on whether your vehicle is throwing a code at the time of inspection or do they actually test content of exhaust gases?
Im no expert but they check codes in NC and I assume if one of the downstream o2 is triggered either by code or not in ready status, it fails.

This happened on my Raptor when I had tuned it and it turned off the downstream o2 for a more aggressive fuel mapping. And happened on my e46 when the MAF sensor was faulty and triggered a CEL it would fail state inspection.

So ultimately, how are all the modders here doing catless pipes and passing emissions inspections?
It really varies state to state. In NY I've always been able to pass without issue as long as the CEL isn't on. In Iowa, they don't check emissions...
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      11-20-2018, 06:50 PM   #5
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On a different platform, I had great luck with an O2 extender, but I was also using a hi-flow cat with it. Without the extender I'd get random dash lights. I'd check the code with an OBD reader, it was catalytic efficiency, I'd clear the code and it'd come back in a month or two. An O2 extender saved the day there, and I could pass emissions testing that was only checking for stored/visible CEL's in CA. An actual sniffer in WA, I did pass too, on yet another platform.

To be completely catless, I see no way for the extenders to work reliably, that it has to be done in tuning. But as you've stated, it needs to be done in a way where the sensor is not disabled and not set to a perpetual not-read state.
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      11-21-2018, 11:51 AM   #6
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Get two of these and install them on the second bungs.

https://www.amazon.com/Degree-Angled...XDHEE9VGRYFW01
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      11-21-2018, 04:58 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9vapors View Post
It really varies state to state. In NY I've always been able to pass without issue as long as the CEL isn't on. In Iowa, they don't check emissions...
This. Some states don’t care about emissions. Some are just looking for the CEL light to be off. Other states will let one or two of the readiness monitors to be “not ready” (which is what a tune generally gets you) and still pass. Other states like NJ will allow one monitor not to be ready, unless it’s cat monitor. Other people just deal with installing and uninstalling the downpipes every few years to pass.
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      11-24-2018, 05:31 PM   #8
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On my F30 328i I have an O2 extender on the rear sensor and no CEL, at all. And of course the power is there, whereas in the past it would never spin the tires from the line, now with TC off it will easily spin them once boost kicks in-which is also far sooner.

I have a pair coming in for my X5M.

In CA, they allow one readiness monitor to be pending and use the OBD port for smog testing. They also conduct a visual but there is no chance they can tell there is a downpipe as it is hidden, unless they conduct a tailpipe test.

Last edited by pearlpower; 11-25-2018 at 11:19 AM..
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      11-24-2018, 06:45 PM   #9
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Loving the input everyone. I have DPs on the way. I just got my state inspection completed so I'll test out the extenders and will most likely find a tune to rid the CEL if extenders do not work.
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      11-25-2018, 03:28 AM   #10
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I'm installing DP's right now, also rebuilding the turbos wastegates and wrapping the headers and DP's so its going to be middle of next week before Im done as I only have an hour or two to work on each day thanks to hectic work. I am installing these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1 for the sensors, I will post back later this week after she is back together if it trips the CEL or not. What I like about those extenders is the different restrictor plates you can select....
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      12-10-2018, 09:24 PM   #11
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Can anyone id whether or not my downpipes are flanged or slip-on? I ordered some from VRSF but they are unable to tell me which ones I need with my VIN.

So took pics of the bottom connection. I've not heard a straight story on what my 2012 would have...

Thx
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      12-10-2018, 09:29 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncbimma View Post
Can anyone id whether or not my downpipes are flanged or slip-on? I ordered some from VRSF but they are unable to tell me which ones I need with my VIN.

So took pics of the bottom connection. I've not heard a straight story on what my 2012 would have...

Thx
2 bolt flange type... just like mine! I also went with VRSF downpipes. Let me know if you have any questions during the install. Check my down pipe thread, I have some tips that I ran into along the way. Biggest thing is that the VRSF downpipes don't come with studs on the bottom, buy some stainless bolts and have them welded in. Get new copper nuts for the install and all of the gaskets. Part numbers are in my install thread as well.

Downpipe Install https://www.xbimmers.com/forums/show....php?t=1537226
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      02-14-2019, 08:01 PM   #13
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Just got my DPs on and damn it's loud!

Big turbo whirr...loud braaaps on gear changes...it's glorious!

I put spacers on my 02 sensors, and so far no CEL. We'll see how long this lasts.
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      02-14-2019, 08:27 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncbimma View Post
Just got my DPs on and damn it's loud!

Big turbo whirr...loud braaaps on gear changes...it's glorious!

I put spacers on my 02 sensors, and so far no CEL. We'll see how long this lasts.
Did you install them? Yeah the cel will come on after about 40 miles if it's going to. Good luck, I hope it stays off for ya.
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      02-14-2019, 09:34 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 9vapors View Post
Did you install them?
I was planning on it last weekend, but snapped my axle last Thursday. With the car already in shop I just gave it to them. Lava wrapped pipes and all.

O2 spacers we're used to back it out of direct flow- hope it maintains no CEL. If not I'm going to try the mini catted O2 extensions.

I'll mount my new wheels tmw and begin my savings for stage2 tune and DSS upgraded axles.

Still getting a flutter on WOT- wondering if it's the DVs so also exploring DV+ upgrades.

I'm fearing the cold start in the morning. I might have some pissed off neighbors...lol.
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      02-14-2019, 09:41 PM   #16
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I sure do... I bought a beater to drive in the mornings and at night. It's that bad. Once it reaches temp, it's really not too bad, but yeah the cold start in a garage is nuts. I wouldn't change it for anything though haha. Smart move to have it all done at once, and really if I could go back, I'd have had a shop do it as well. Do you know who you'll tune with? I am looking at the DV+ as well, but was put off a bit after Jandref321's issues... still need to do some more research. I'm more interested in a catch can and replacing some of the problem parts with different hoses etc. I'll start playing with it again as it warms up a bit, my garage isn't heated and it sucks working on the car in the cold. Glad you got everything sorted out though. I wish you luck with the cel.
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      02-14-2019, 10:22 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by 9vapors View Post
Do you know who you'll tune with?
The (2) I'm considering are Velos or Bimmer Performance Center.

The latter only because they are in my backyard in Raleigh, so it's convenient.

But I'm still scouring around for options- there's ups and downs for all which clouds the overall experiences.

I have my wife's car and a 356 speedster in the garage stealing the indoor spots and my 2nd car is a '72 2002 with no heat- been an interesting week- by no means not Midwest cold tho
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      02-14-2019, 10:46 PM   #18
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Wait around or contact Velos to be put on a list for a refurb one... I paid $1000 for mine that way including the stg 2+. Amazing tune, changes the overall ride and feel of the M so much. You think the downpipes made a difference... I still want to pick up a set of the RK intakes, but my custom o es are good enough for now.

I love that 2002 btw, I need to get me an older project like that.
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      02-14-2019, 11:10 PM   #19
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Das ist gut, ja
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      02-14-2019, 11:24 PM   #20
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Quite the stable... what is you X5M lowered on? Never mind, I remember you're on H&R 2.0 like me...
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      02-14-2019, 11:27 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by 9vapors View Post
Quite the stable... what is you X5M lowered on?
H&R 2.0

Without getting the shorter bumpstops

Highly recommend getting the shorter ones or be ready for spinal compression on big dips.

I do t want to go thru the work again to change it yet.
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      02-15-2019, 10:03 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ncbimma View Post
Just got my DPs on and damn it's loud!

Big turbo whirr...loud braaaps on gear changes...it's glorious!

I put spacers on my 02 sensors, and so far no CEL. We'll see how long this lasts.
A little trick I found was putting some of the catalytic material inside the spacer will help keep the CEL off. I did this on my E39 when I had headers put on and it worked like a charm. If you have access to a junkyard, see if you can cut open a converter and take some of the matrix material. I dont have any left otheriwse I would send it to you.
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