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      12-07-2018, 02:27 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000cs View Post
I’ve read a lot on this, but am by no means an expert. Perhaps the most enlightening read was in The Code Breakers by David Kahn. My take on that is the US knew but didn’t know; we had the data but couldn’t make it into information timely to understand what was happening and take action. Clearly, if we had known an attack was coming there were better ways to engage and thereby “get in the war” than to sit back and let this attack take place as it unfolded.

Regardless of what was happening at political levels, and the other effects of the attack, a lot of men lost their lives at Pearl Harbor. It is those men whose memory I honor today.


Here, here.

Yes - irrespective of whether someone wan'ts to believe some of the more unlikely theories - we should all put that aside for at least today to honor those who lost their lives.

I spent many years living on base at Pearl, and feel a special connection to the place and the sacrifice that so many gave that day.
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      12-07-2018, 02:29 PM   #24
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
I'm done since trolls don't deserve discussions and arguing with idiots just makes everyone dumber.


You do have a point there.

Regardless, it is a day to remember historical events in the hope we learn something from such events, and don't repeat them.
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      12-07-2018, 02:39 PM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
I spent many years living on base at Pearl, and feel a special connection to the place and the sacrifice that so many gave that day.
Me too, my office windows were surrounded by bulllet holes from the gunfire during the attack. (Hickam side)
Everyday I was reminded of the sacrifices, and also feel a connection to the place. I still have my HI driver license/cell number, even though it has been over a decade since I moved from the islands.
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      12-07-2018, 02:47 PM   #26
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Enough information was known that an attack on US interests somewhere was imminent and a Japanese fleet was steaming across the Pacific. That the state of readiness was what it was (lack thereof) at PH was inexcusable at that time.
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      12-07-2018, 02:55 PM   #27
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Originally Posted by minn19 View Post
Enough information was known that an attack on US interests somewhere was imminent and a Japanese fleet was steaming across the Pacific. That the state of readiness was what it was (lack thereof) at PH was inexcusable at that time.
Lets try this again. Perhaps you can put aside your argumentative nature for a day and just honor those who died.

Too much to ask?

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      12-07-2018, 02:59 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Lets try this again. Perhaps you can put aside your argumentative nature for a day and just honor those who died.

Too much to ask?

Then probably shouldn’t have posted thread in the political section lol
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      12-07-2018, 03:02 PM   #29
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Some more photos from the days after.









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      12-07-2018, 03:03 PM   #30
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Originally Posted by Mingwan View Post
Then probably shouldn’t have posted thread in the political section lol
Well that's just a sad commentary on society, then, isn't it? The thread wasn't titled as a debate of the merits of US involvement, was just a thread setup to honor those who gave all.
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      12-07-2018, 03:06 PM   #31
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Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Well that's just a sad commentary on society, then, isn't it? The thread wasn't titled as a debate of the merits of US involvement, was just a thread setup to honor those who gave all.
Haha, society in general is sad.
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      12-07-2018, 03:08 PM   #32
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I was there a few months ago. The locals were saying parts of the memorial were slowly disappearing underwater. That true?
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      12-07-2018, 03:09 PM   #33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usshelena725 View Post
Lets try this again. Perhaps you can put aside your argumentative nature for a day and just honor those who died.

Too much to ask?

Part of honoring them is trying to figure out why we were caught with our pants down so badly so we don’t have so many others killed needlessly. I’ve been there and honor their sacrifice very much. I’ve also been to the gun that sits on the MN/St. Paul capital grounds that fired the first shots of the war and sunk a Japanese mini sub. Which also should of spurred the commanders into general quarters for the base......oops I’m not supposed to talk about that stuff.
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      12-07-2018, 08:13 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2000cs View Post
I’ve read a lot on this, but am by no means an expert. Perhaps the most enlightening read was in The Code Breakers by David Kahn. My take on that is the US knew but didn’t know; we had the data but couldn’t make it into information timely to understand what was happening and take action. Clearly, if we had known an attack was coming there were better ways to engage and thereby “get in the war” than to sit back and let this attack take place as it unfolded.

Regardless of what was happening at political levels, and the other effects of the attack, a lot of men lost their lives at Pearl Harbor. It is those men whose memory I honor today.
I read Code Breakers as well. We owe a great deal to our Native Americans. A great deal.

--

Folks, we need to remember where technology was in 1941. Radar was very crude. The quality of radio transmissions varied wildly. There were no cellphone or smartphones. Long distance telephone was unreliable and often difficult to understand - and sometimes dead in the water, not to mention that you had to stand in line to make the call (with a pocket full of coins).
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