2013 X5M Engine Failure

[RSmokos]

Update: Dealer confirmed that it wasn't the top end or any of the workmanship associated with the recent replacement he did of the VSS (saw that coming). They think it's either a spun bearing and/or oil pump failure. There starting a case ticket with BMWUSA. I'll know next week what this is going to cost me.

If and when it comes to the rebuild would appreciate any recommendations on what to strengthen so this doesn't happen in the next 75K miles.

[windsailor]

I feel your pain and get concerned as have the same x5m '13, wish you the best and will be coming back to learn more

[laselvasurf]

Originally Posted by RSmokos

Update: Dealer confirmed that it wasn't the top end or any of the workmanship associated with the recent replacement he did of the VSS (saw that coming). They think it's either a spun bearing and/or oil pump failure. There starting a case ticket with BMWUSA. I'll know next week what this is going to cost me.

If and when it comes to the rebuild would appreciate any recommendations on what to strengthen so this doesn't happen in the next 75K miles.

Sorry to hear this. My shop thinks I have a spun bearing as well and they started the full tear down to do a proper diagnosis yesterday. I should have an update on Monday.

[yco]

Originally Posted by RSmokos

Update: Dealer confirmed that it wasn't the top end or any of the workmanship associated with the recent replacement he did of the VSS (saw that coming). They think it's either a spun bearing and/or oil pump failure. There starting a case ticket with BMWUSA. I'll know next week what this is going to cost me.

If and when it comes to the rebuild would appreciate any recommendations on what to strengthen so this doesn't happen in the next 75K miles.

it doesnt sound that bad but still..

[Thecastle]

Bearing failures hu. Fuel dilution of oil?

This is my second bmw v8 and I purchased it specifically as more reliable replacement of my old n62..... so far so good, but this makes me a little concerned two in a row. Where either of you modified?

[IN-FLT]

BMW had issues with the S65 and S85 main bearings as well. They really should have done something about it and I know many pushed to get them to address it, but nothing ever happened.

Sad to hear this.. also have a 13' X5M .. Good luck with this!

[laselvasurf]

Quick update... Shop disabled the front end and found two bearings completely shot. They are waiting on the warranty inspector to come see the damage before approving anything. My mechanic thinks they will want to just drop a used engine in, to save on labor costs. That said, the cheapest used engine is over $12K, so getting a rebuilt from ghassan or troy seems like it might be the less expensive and better option(for me especially).

I've read a bunch of reviews for both ghassan and troy jeup, both extremely good and many extremely bad. I'd love any personal feedback for either if anyone has had any experience as I think I'll be going with one of them.

I've attached some photos of the vehicle dismantled and the damage.

[Kraftwerk AG]

Originally Posted by laselvasurf

Quick update... Shop disabled the front end and found two bearings completely shot. They are waiting on the warranty inspector to come see the damage before approving anything. My mechanic thinks they will want to just drop a used engine in, to save on labor costs. That said, the cheapest used engine is over $12K, so getting a rebuilt from ghassan or troy seems like it might be the less expensive and better option(for me especially).

I've read a bunch of reviews for both ghassan and troy jeup, both extremely good and many extremely bad. I'd love any personal feedback for either if anyone has had any experience as I think I'll be going with one of them.

I've attached some photos of the vehicle dismantled and the damage.

Ouch! Sorry I can't comment on Ghassan and Troy Jeup. I'm sure someone will chime in soon. I hope this all works out favorably for you. WTH causes this? smh

[TwinSnailz]

Originally Posted by DeeO

Ouch!WTH causes this? smh

Most likely oil starvation or degradation of slicks in oil. DI fuel dilution + extended oil drains.

Change your oil every 5k miles boys and girls. Go to Walmart and pick up 2 jugs of 0w-40 ($50) and just drain the oil and put fresh one in. You don’t even have to change the filter until the next time around.
Your bearings ,turbos , cams and everything else will thank you. Seals will prolong as well. Fuel will harden rubber and cause them to fail “cough valve seals”.

OP, that sucks man. Speedy recovery for you. Btw were there any ticks prior to this?

[laselvasurf]

Originally Posted by TwinSnailz

Most likely oil starvation or degradation of slicks in oil. DI fuel dilution + extended oil drains.

Change your oil every 5k miles boys and girls. Go to Walmart and pick up 2 jugs of 0w-40 ($50) and just drain the oil and put fresh one in. You don’t even have to change the filter until the next time around.
Your bearings ,turbos , cams and everything else will thank you. Seals will prolong as well. Fuel will harden rubber and cause them to fail “cough valve seals”.

OP, that sucks man. Speedy recovery for you. Btw were there any ticks prior to this?

Thanks, it'll be at least a month before I'm back on the road, but I'm already looking forward to it.

The engine sounded and ran perfectly 30 seconds before this happened. The oil level was full 2 days before as I specifically remember checking it.

Here's what happened... I was stopped chatting with someone about his car(custom hot rod) while it my X5M idling and I was standing next to it. The engine sounded completely normal, no ticks of any kind. After saying g'bye, I jumped in and started driving away. The oil temp was up just under 210, I accelerated somewhat aggressively(I'd say 70%), though no where near floored and about 2 seconds after it shifted into 2nd the car died. I only noticed because the power steering stopped working, I wasn't even accelerating hard enough to notice the exhaust cut out. I coasted to a safe place and tried to start the car. It cranked a few times, but then just stopped. I thought maybe a computer had a fault, so I unplugged the battery for 15 minutes and tried again. A few more cranks, but it wouldn't turn over. That's when I called the tow truck.

As for oil changes... I've owned BMWs for 10+ years and I completely and totally agree. The previous owner of my X5M changed the oil only when the computer told him too. He actually changed it right before I bought it and I changed it again less than a 1000 miles ago. I have always gone with the 5K interval for oil changes and I've had BMWs make it to nearly a quarter million miles with no engine issues(ran perfectly when I sold it!). Once I get this back on the road, it will be on the strict 5K interval.

[laselvasurf]

Originally Posted by s390er

My God!

This sounds far too similar to what I experienced this past week! 2012 X5M , Has 62000KMS , All services were done at the dealer and all recalls were up to date other then the latest auxiliary waterpump recall! The car got really loud and rumbled till I came to a stop and turned it off. After turning it off , it wouldn't startup! Towed it to BMW MARKHAM in Toronto , Canada. Now they want me to dish out $47000 for a new engine or 20 hrs labor at my expense just to diagnose what the issue could be! Contacted BMW Canada and ended up at a international call centre which doesn't seem to be leading me anywhere as of yet. The N63 and S63 engines both share the same timing chains and injectors. WHY ARE THESE NOT RECALLED YET! Please DM me and lets start contacting BMW NA and BMW CANADA to make a list of Vins all facing this same timing chain issue. 62000kms! that's a mere 37500 MILES! The only reason in my opinion why this hasn't been recalled is because there was fewer S63 engine vehicles as opposed to the N63 model which had a vast amount of models which included it. Is there anywhere else we can contact?? I'm sure we will be heard if we can get a group together! Even if someone was to do an out of pocket repair , the value of the vehicle is less then what they want to charge for replacing the engines. The N63 engines dropped drastically in price from the dealer after all these timing chain issues arose. Lets try to contact BMW and get something done out of this!

I have attached the codes which my mobile obd reader read off the car before I dropped it off , I also attached all the recall work done on this car since new! The dealer system couldn't read any of these codes even though my mobile obd reader did! The paperwork attached shows what my bmw service advisor sent me

Yikes! I too heard the roughly $40,000(usd) figure to get a new engine from BMW. The fact that you had this failure at such low miles is shocking. How often have you had the oil changed?

[s390er]

I only recently purchased this vehicle off the original owner but he would do a yearly preventative maintainence even when he'd drive 4-5000 kms ! I have went ahead and reported my issue on the Canadian and us road safety sites.


Canada: https://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur....aspx?lang=eng

USA : https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/VehicleComplaint/

the more people we can get onboard , the bigger probability we can get the N63 service campaign to include the S63 engine! Most components are identical and shared! Those of you who spent this type of money should be reimbursed. This is definitely a SAFETY CONCERN ! MY POWER STEERING ALSO STOPPED AT 100-120KM/H , That's a huge safety concern . these must be addressed and right away!

[s390er]

Can an administrator make this thread a sticky so we can get everyone facing this issue to put there say in

[m5james]

I'm going to call in simply because it's not something I've dealt with directly...yet. I read about the N54 injector recall before it came out for the S63, yet while BMW denied it, mine failed...the last thing I want is timing chain to fail because of BMW's continued insistence on dragging their feet. If the EXACT same part is defective on one vehicle, it should be addressed on ALL platforms...the fact that we're running 150hp more than the N63 means we're even more prone to it!!!

[s390er]

Originally Posted by m5james

I'm going to call in simply because it's not something I've dealt with directly...yet. I read about the N54 injector recall before it came out for the S63, yet while BMW denied it, mine failed...the last thing I want is timing chain to fail because of BMW's continued insistence on dragging their feet. If the EXACT same part is defective on one vehicle, it should be addressed on ALL platforms...the fact that we're running 150hp more than the N63 means we're even more prone to it!!!

I know right!!

[RSmokos]

Update: Well local BMW who did the VSS less than 2 months ago determined that it wasn't their workmanship (yeah, I know what other outcome would there be). They submitted the case to BMWUSA and BMWUSA and the dealer quoted a replacement engine at $34K. As part of a good will, BMWUSA offered a free engine and the dealer quoted $10K to replace the engine plus a 2 year unlimited warranty. So I get a new engine installed and warranty for $10K. Now I'd rather have a "strengthened" engine, but I think going the local BMW dealer option over the Ghassan alternative is probably the right choice here. Anything comes up in the future, it's right down the road. Mind you I think I'm still getting stiffed as there's no way it's $10K to pull and install an engine, but $10K all said and done, ok.

I'm going to see if I can get them to pull the oil pan and see exactly what happened. I'll update as I go here.

[s390er]

Originally Posted by RSmokos

Update: Well local BMW who did the VSS less than 2 months ago determined that it wasn't their workmanship (yeah, I know what other outcome would there be). They submitted the case to BMWUSA and BMWUSA and the dealer quoted a replacement engine at $34K. As part of a good will, BMWUSA offered a free engine and the dealer quoted $10K to replace the engine plus a 2 year unlimited warranty. So I get a new engine installed and warranty for $10K. Now I'd rather have a "strengthened" engine, but I think going the local BMW dealer option over the Ghassan alternative is probably the right choice here. Anything comes up in the future, it's right down the road. Mind you I think I'm still getting stiffed as there's no way it's $10K to pull and install an engine, but $10K all said and done, ok.

I'm going to see if I can get them to pull the oil pan and see exactly what happened. I'll update as I go here.

Thats not bad, i'd love to have an option like that at this point, is there anyway you could dm your case number so i could ask them to refer to that in the meanwhile incase they give me no other options?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by RSmokos

Update: Well local BMW who did the VSS less than 2 months ago determined that it wasn't their workmanship (yeah, I know what other outcome would there be). They submitted the case to BMWUSA and BMWUSA and the dealer quoted a replacement engine at $34K. As part of a good will, BMWUSA offered a free engine and the dealer quoted $10K to replace the engine plus a 2 year unlimited warranty. So I get a new engine installed and warranty for $10K. Now I'd rather have a "strengthened" engine, but I think going the local BMW dealer option over the Ghassan alternative is probably the right choice here. Anything comes up in the future, it's right down the road. Mind you I think I'm still getting stiffed as there's no way it's $10K to pull and install an engine, but $10K all said and done, ok.

I'm going to see if I can get them to pull the oil pan and see exactly what happened. I'll update as I go here.

Even though BMW should have covered the labor (I'm actually surprised they didn't....are you sure the dealer isnt double dipping?) 10K sound about right for engine swap as they have to pull over everything, injectors, turbos, manifolds, fuel pumps, vac pump, sensors, hell probably even water pump probably isn't included on new engine. I think labor time is 40 hours on the N63 & S63 and at 200ish an hour plus all the misc parts and gaskets....then they slap on another 2K "M" tax....so 10K sounds like the full retail price for labor and parts

[m5james]

Dealerships make less money on warranty work than they do straight work...they're absolutely double dipping. While it's great that BMWUSA stepped up to the plate here, I'd still talk to them directly and casually ask why you still have to pay for $10k in labor and see if that's an indirect way of throwing your dealership under the bus.

[laselvasurf]

Originally Posted by RSmokos

Update: Well local BMW who did the VSS less than 2 months ago determined that it wasn't their workmanship (yeah, I know what other outcome would there be). They submitted the case to BMWUSA and BMWUSA and the dealer quoted a replacement engine at $34K. As part of a good will, BMWUSA offered a free engine and the dealer quoted $10K to replace the engine plus a 2 year unlimited warranty. So I get a new engine installed and warranty for $10K. Now I'd rather have a "strengthened" engine, but I think going the local BMW dealer option over the Ghassan alternative is probably the right choice here. Anything comes up in the future, it's right down the road. Mind you I think I'm still getting stiffed as there's no way it's $10K to pull and install an engine, but $10K all said and done, ok.

I'm going to see if I can get them to pull the oil pan and see exactly what happened. I'll update as I go here.

That's great news. The $10K for the engine install is definitely expensive! Almost double the cost compared to my indie mechanic.

I'm curious, how long have you owned the X5M? I wonder if there is any chance I could get a good will replacement from BMW, even though I haven't had the work done at the dealership. Does anyone have experience with that?

[protecon]

At least the US owners actually have recalls and SIB - BMW Australia don't even recognise the service bulletins.

[s390er]

Spoke to BMW canada. Ultimately they don't want ti assist in any way shape or form. They say warrant is 4 years 80000kms, anything past that is not covered even though there was so much work completed on this car over the past year recalls of front propeller and driveshaft. They see our concerns but just want to deflect and not address. I was speaking to bongal case manager and she refused to let me speak to anyone higher then herself and stated that she makes the final decision based on bmw canada management. Is there any other assistance i can get?