09-19-2014, 09:38 AM | #23 |
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+1. We know the M3 is underrated, and just like the e63, this will be too.
And given that a C63 LCI was faster on many tracks than the e9x m3, this car is going to be either ahead of the m3/4 or pretty equal. We all know that even though the C63 Black Series was 510 hp and 4000 plus lbs, it bested the 3400 lbs 450 hp M3 GTS with relative ease. As I said, Merc at their best, BMW simply cant compete with. BMW is too busy making underperforming and ugly hyrids like the i8. |
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09-19-2014, 10:44 AM | #24 | |
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09-19-2014, 11:15 AM | #25 |
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Well, the M4 made 484 hp on Dinan's engine dyno. They posted a thread here with detailed graphs.
So yeah, I'd say the M4 is a bit underrated from the factory. I believe that is what the poster was referring to.
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09-19-2014, 11:20 AM | #26 |
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omfg can't wait.
i had my eyes set on the F80 M3 as my next car, but the W205 has certainly swayed my decision. so exciting!
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09-19-2014, 11:20 AM | #27 |
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Yes, when people are putting down 420-420 RWHP on a stock car, yes thats pretty damn underrated.
And when Dinan does an engine dyno that shows crank hp at 484, pretty safe to say this car is making about 60 mpre hp than stated or ~14% more than the factory rating. |
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09-19-2014, 11:25 AM | #28 | |
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09-19-2014, 11:28 AM | #29 | |
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Look at the Hellcat. 707hp yet the times are barely better than the 580hp ZL1. It can't launch or use first gear because its only got power to 2 wheels. Yet the much less powerful GT-R and 911 Turbo put down better times. AWD FTW. BTW, can't really compare the RS5 to the 507 edition C63. Its got 57 less hp and gobs less torque. AWD can't make make up for an inferior engine, which the 4.2 most certainly is. Its come to a point where tires technology simply hasn't kept up with engine tech. Engines make way more power than just 2 tires can effectively put down. Hell, last night my 750 squealed all 4, and I wasn't even hard on the gas. Until tire tech catches up, AWD will be considered a must have on performance cars. AMG put it on their more expensive cars because I thought they realized that, and maybe on those cars they did. Perhaps they're making the C63 for hooligans who don't care about real performance and are just interested in making smoke. Thats pretty much what high powered 2wd cars on street tires do best. Just my $0.10. |
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09-19-2014, 11:34 AM | #30 | |
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I do however think given the car has about 500 hp it doesnt perform like a 500 hp car. 500 hp car should be trapping well into the 120 range and this one is like 117-119 based on results seen thus far. |
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09-19-2014, 11:48 AM | #31 |
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09-19-2014, 12:23 PM | #32 | |
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09-19-2014, 12:24 PM | #33 | |
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09-19-2014, 01:00 PM | #34 | |
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Personally, I'm looking forward to the C63, but I'm honestly looking to downsize to a smaller model now.
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09-19-2014, 01:19 PM | #35 |
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An estate would be awesome. Is it coming to the US?
Estate or sedan it's going to be brutal. Hopefully the handling will finally feel as crisp and athletic as an M3. Interesting times. |
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09-19-2014, 01:32 PM | #36 | |
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of course its not all about power. there are just so many fast cars out today, the M3 is less appealing than ever before IMO. I honestly think the golden days of the M3 are over. the E46 days, and its never going to get back to that. the E92 wasn't even that great of a car, i just really really love this engine. |
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09-19-2014, 01:49 PM | #37 | |
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its all relative to the width of the wheel of course
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09-19-2014, 01:52 PM | #38 | |
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the list of cars that have overpromised on weight targets is very long -mustang gt -corvette -m3 -m235 -standard c class -audi a3/s3 to name a few
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09-19-2014, 01:55 PM | #39 |
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+1
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09-19-2014, 01:58 PM | #40 | |
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what do you know about golden days? or any of these cars? have you even driven any of these cars you talk about? on the track? any experience on track? ive owned and tracked 3 different m cars, and will track my f8x too. you don't have any perspective to speak from on these cars, so why try? I can tell you first off that a car that traps 119mph stock (like the m3) is a freaking handful on the street and track. both this and the c63 are really fast cars and IMO cater to different people. the m3 still offers something that the merc cant offer, a more raw and unfiltered experience. lighter weight, light weight tech, more sophisticated differential and suspension tech and a manual. doesn't mean those things appeal to everyone, but the m3 exists in this form because they do to many of us EDIT : and FYI, the e92 came out in the USA the same year the much more powerful c63 did. and the audi rs4 already made 420 hp since 2006
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09-19-2014, 02:51 PM | #41 | |
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What part of it is wrong? |
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09-19-2014, 03:34 PM | #42 | |
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Otherwise, AWD cars with true torque vectoring will help mitigate some of that understeer and make it an epic performer (see GT-R, 997 and up 911 Turbo/S etc etc.)
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09-19-2014, 03:47 PM | #43 | |
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I know several folks that have hit the high 11s (11.8-9) in stock* C63s (*with drag radials). Personally, I disagree that AWD is a must-have on modern "performance" cars. Proper driving techniques and proper tires can make up for the lack of all-wheel traction. Sure, AWD makes it easier (in some respects) to track a car on street tires at a road course. I still prefer a car with a tendency to oversteer over one with a tendency for understeer. Out of curiosity, what are you thoughts on the new M3/M4 then? Or the new Corvette Stingray? Too much power and torque since they're both RWD platforms?
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09-19-2014, 04:43 PM | #44 | |
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it has to do with the point of view from the car buyer. My self, i am looking for a car within a certain price point. I weigh my options out. It just feels like other car companies are do more appealing stuff. thats really all it is. I mean , ford is about to come out with a high revving flat plane N/A V8 with 600HP. that is totally insane.... thats something Ferrari would do, FORD ? ??? |
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