Go Newt

[ScotchAndCigar]

Originally Posted by cssnms

REALLY??? That is really scary to hear because it would seem to me not only does Obama fall into several of the categories in which you describe, but many others which in my opinion are far worse. He is a liar, a socialist, a man who routinely attended the church of a radical prejudice preacher, a man that worked with and socialized with terrorist Bill Ayers, a man who has surrounded himself with many people in his administration that touch on every one of your categories to include known tax cheats, corruption etc.

It is clear to me you have no idea what is going on with this country right now and are either uninformed or blinded by the man's charisma, which unfortunately descirbes a large majority of people in this country, which in itself is scary to think about. I will take any one of the GOP candidates over a man that is running this great country of ours into the ground; okay Ron Paul scares me a little bit.

This country is lead by a man that believes the government is here to solve everyone's problems. A man that believes in robbing Peter to pay Paul while Paul chose not to get a high school education sits on his ass all day collecting a pay check funded by yours truly and has otherwise no incentive to get a job. A man that believes the government actually "creates" jobs. A man that believes in a government that should regulate every aspect of business and your life to include requiring you to get health care. A man that believes continuing to sink this country into financial oblivion while at the same time borrowing money it does not have from communist China to fund this administration's social programs/agenda at the expense of my children's future. A man that believes he can spend this country into prosperity. A man that believes prosperity is a strong BIG government in which its citizens have become dependent on for their survival. This is a man whose beliefs and agenda fly in the face of this great country's founding principles and has a complete disregard for liberty and freedom.

The average debt you and I owe because of the fiscal irresponsibility of this and past administrations totals approximately $55k for every man, woman and child living in the US and that amount is rapidly growing. I will vote for anyone that is NOT Obama this election, because we cannot afford to continue down the path we are on.

This looks like a post from a tea-partier circa 2006; try updating your battle cry.

And by the way, for a country that was deep into the largest recession since the great depression just 3 years ago, we're doing pretty damn well. Many of us have posted evidence of this in this forum, over the past year or so, so I'm not going to repeat it here. Of course, you're entitled to vehemently disagree, as I'm sure you do. Just be aware that I'm not about to rehash every debate I've had with posters like you. Have a nice day!

[ScotchAndCigar]

Originally Posted by cssnms

one of the best Presidents this country has ever seen, Ronald Reagan

Funny you say that, as his first term was also categorized by a waning recession and skyrocketing unemployment. And despite being embroiled in the Iran-Contra affair (in which people went to jail), he was re-elected, enabling him to finish his term over the ensuing cyclical economic boom - just like during Clinton's presidency, whom you failed to mention.

[Team Plutonium]

Originally Posted by cssnms

While I agree with some of what you say e.g. Germany builds some nice cars, many in the US don't know what socialism is or its consequences, I do not agree there is any confusion with regard to the definition of a socialist government and a communist government despite similarities between the two with regard to government run/funded programs. The best example to differentiate between the two which I am sure you can relate were the stark differences between East and West Germany. Most on this board were not alive when that wall came down. What a liberating moment that was, thanks in large part to the influence of arguably one of the best Presidents this country has ever seen, Ronald Reagan, a democrat turned republican that believed in smaller government and lower taxes would lead to prosperity; how right he was! Those were the good 'ol days....

While true Germany's economy is one of the strongest in the European Union, today it is more of a pseudo capitalistic society with many socialist programs such as national health care, not much unlike what Obama is trying to create here. However on the opposite of end of the spectrum all Germany has to do is take a look around them to see what happens when the government and its policies become to overreaching e.g. Greece, U.K. and the list goes on.

As a German (living in NY?) I would not expect you to be familiar with or necessarily understand our country's founding principles and despite the fact that the Constitution remains the supreme law of the United States there are certain people to include many in the current administration that disregard the Constitution when setting policy. I have noticed a dramatic shift in our government over the last 20 years and it's that shift that has lead us to where we are today and I do not just blame the current administration or just democrats. There is a deep seeded problem with our government which is fueled by corrupt politicians, the fact that there are no term limits on these politicians, crony capitalism, and an inherent incentive for government officials to justify their existence/jobs through the creation of more regulation and needless policies all in the name of job security. More policies and more regulation means a bigger more expensive government and these same politicians are expected to find a way to cut meezly $1 trillion from our bloated budget?! HA

People in this country need to wake up. For a glimpse into the future, just take a look at what is happening in Greece.

Some valid points, but the problems in Greece have nothing to do with socialism. The problem with Greece is (was) the ridiculous large government, employing people with no real jobs (government jobs), and no real economy. No exports and mediocre tourism at best, folks retiring too early (with government pensions), and tax evaders that make the wall street crowd look like commies.

And it looks like Germany will have to pay for this mess. Public health care, or any other similar programs didn't even remotely play a factor to the collapse.

[txz4]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Some valid points, but the problems in Greece have nothing to do with socialism. The problem with Greece is (was) the ridiculous large government, employing people with no real jobs (government jobs), and no real economy. No exports and mediocre tourism at best, folks retiring too early (with government pensions), and tax evaders that make the wall street crowd look like commies.

And it looks like Germany will have to pay for this mess. Public health care, or any other similar programs didn't even remotely play a factor to the collapse.

The kind of socialism this regime wants is exactly like what you described of Greece. Think of Europe like the U.S. the responsible states have to pay for the irresponsible ones, and because of irresponsibility business moves from unfriendly to friendly states. Similar to the Euro debt crisis when the burden caused by collectors on producers becomes to much a debt crisis is born.

Regardless if what the guy a few post above said was a "2006 tea party battle cry" or whatever you called it, it doesnt make it less right. Last i checked pythagorus is old news yet his theorem still reigns true.

[Team Plutonium]

Originally Posted by txz4;11365607[B

]The kind of socialism this regime wants is exactly like what you described of Greece.[/b] Think of Europe like the U.S. the responsible states have to pay for the irresponsible ones, and because of irresponsibility business moves from unfriendly to friendly states. Similar to the Euro debt crisis when the burden caused by collectors on producers becomes to much a debt crisis is born.

Regardless if what the guy a few post above said was a "2006 tea party battle cry" or whatever you called it, it doesnt make it less right. Last i checked pythagorus is old news yet his theorem still reigns true.

Oh, please... what a ridiculous statement. And again, the cluster fuck in Greece has nothing to do with socialism. But more importantly - Obama is so far away from being a socialist as he is a muslim.

[cssnms]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Some valid points, but the problems in Greece have nothing to do with socialism. The problem with Greece is (was) the ridiculous large government, employing people with no real jobs (government jobs), and no real economy. No exports and mediocre tourism at best, folks retiring too early (with government pensions), and tax evaders that make the wall street crowd look like commies.

And it looks like Germany will have to pay for this mess. Public health care, or any other similar programs didn't even remotely play a factor to the collapse.

I disagree with your assesment behind the cause. In fact just about everything that you cited is a bi-product of their socialistic government. While true the government is to big, which is often the case with a socialistic government, Greece's debt crises has little to do with the fact their government employs to many people, as I said it's just a bi-product. The problems lie in an ideaology that a government's roll is to provide for the people. Greece continues to sponsor entitlement programs which it cannot afford, going into debt doing so, not much unlike what is happening in the UK and very much the direction this country is taking. That is why there is rioting, people do not want the government to take away the hand-outs. Laying off government employees is a short-term fix to a problem that runs much deeper. The fact they have "no real economy" is further evidence that a socialistic government does nothing to create jobs or bolster an economy, that's just smoke and mirrors.

[cssnms]

Originally Posted by ScotchAndCigar

This looks like a post from a tea-partier circa 2006; try updating your battle cry.

And by the way, for a country that was deep into the largest recession since the great depression just 3 years ago, we're doing pretty damn well. Many of us have posted evidence of this in this forum, over the past year or so, so I'm not going to repeat it here. Of course, you're entitled to vehemently disagree, as I'm sure you do. Just be aware that I'm not about to rehash every debate I've had with posters like you. Have a nice day!

First let me say that you know nothing about me, so please do not assume you know who I am or where I come from. Secondly, despite quoting me, I appreciate the fact that you have taken the position you have because I am not going to debate with a socialist ideologue like yourself. The only thing I do agree with you on is the "battle cry," because you are right this is a battle to take back this country. Complacent people that are of the delusion that "we're doing pretty darn well" is what is going to bring down this country. People like you will never agree that a smaller government, less regulation, fewer entitlements and lower taxes for everyone are a good thing for this country. You are certainly entitled to your opinion and to voice that opinion, I mean it is freedoms like that which make this country so great. Perhaps one day when your children are paying the price you will think otherwise, but then again maybe not...

[Templar]

Originally Posted by cssnms

REALLY??? That is really scary to hear because it would seem to me not only does Obama fall into several of the categories in which you describe, but many others which in my opinion are far worse. He is a liar, a socialist, a man who routinely attended the church of a radical prejudice preacher, a man that worked with and socialized with terrorist Bill Ayers, a man who has surrounded himself with many people in his administration that touch on every one of your categories to include known tax cheats, corruption etc.

It is clear to me you have no idea what is going on with this country right now and are either uninformed or blinded by the man's charisma, which unfortunately descirbes a large majority of people in this country, which in itself is scary to think about. I will take any one of the GOP candidates over a man that is running this great country of ours into the ground; okay Ron Paul scares me a little bit.

This country is lead by a man that believes the government is here to solve everyone's problems. A man that believes in robbing Peter to pay Paul while Paul chose not to get a high school education sits on his ass all day collecting a pay check funded by yours truly and has otherwise no incentive to get a job. A man that believes the government actually "creates" jobs. A man that believes in a government that should regulate every aspect of business and your life to include requiring you to get health care. A man that believes continuing to sink this country into financial oblivion while at the same time borrowing money it does not have from communist China to fund this administration's social programs/agenda at the expense of my children's future. A man that believes he can spend this country into prosperity. A man that believes prosperity is a strong BIG government in which its citizens have become dependent on for their survival. This is a man whose beliefs and agenda fly in the face of this great country's founding principles and has a complete disregard for liberty and freedom.

The average debt you and I owe because of the fiscal irresponsibility of this and past administrations totals approximately $55k for every man, woman and child living in the US and that amount is rapidly growing. I will vote for anyone that is NOT Obama this election, because we cannot afford to continue down the path we are on.

Way to not read anything I have ever posted in the politics/religion forum, take one part of one sentence I typed, and assume you know everything about me.

You sound like someone else I know in these parts of the forums....

[cssnms]

Originally Posted by Templar

You sound like someone else I know in these parts of the forums....

Please don't tell me,,,, S-n-C?

[ScotchAndCigar]

Originally Posted by cssnms

First let me say that you know nothing about me, so please do not assume you know who I am or where I come from.

I am not going to debate with a socialist ideologue like yourself.

People like you will never agree that a smaller government, less regulation, fewer entitlements and lower taxes for everyone are a good thing for this country. Perhaps one day when your children are paying the price you will think otherwise, but then again maybe not...

You need to check the definition of "hypocrite"; it is well illustrated by juxtaposing your first two sentences quoted.

What prompted the first statement, anyway? I noted that the rhetoric in your post was remniscient of a certain "type" - I never claimed anything about you.

I'd love a smaller gov't, and I'd like lower property taxes, but neither of them have or will happen, regardless of who's in office, so I don't whine about it. As far as entitlements, the two significant ones are SSI and Medicaire, and I've yet to hear anything coherent from the repubs on those. Meanwhile, all of you are spending your time complaining about the 1.7% of the population that's on a significant amount of welfare. Get your priorities straight.

[ghosthi32]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Oh, please... what a ridiculous statement. And again, the cluster fuck in Greece has nothing to do with socialism. But more importantly - Obama is so far away from being a socialist as he is a muslim.

so many people dont know what socialism truly is.

[cssnms]

There you go again... You are just like your fearless leader 0bama, you can't keep your word. Keep living life with your head burried in the sand, pretty soon it is going to be to late, but something tells me that will be alright with you.

Originally Posted by ScotchAndCigar

You need to check the definition of "hypocrite"; it is well illustrated by juxtaposing your first two sentences quoted.

What prompted the first statement, anyway? I noted that the rhetoric in your post was remniscient of a certain "type" - I never claimed anything about you.

I'd love a smaller gov't, and I'd like lower property taxes, but neither of them have or will happen, regardless of who's in office, so I don't whine about it. As far as entitlements, the two significant ones are SSI and Medicaire, and I've yet to hear anything coherent from the repubs on those. Meanwhile, all of you are spending your time complaining about the 1.7% of the population that's on a significant amount of welfare. Get your priorities straight.

[ScotchAndCigar]

Originally Posted by cssnms

you can't keep your word

...explain?...

[ScotchAndCigar]

Originally Posted by ScotchAndCigar

I'm not about to rehash every debate I've had with posters like you.

I think I got it! You thought this meant I would completely stop posting?

[txz4]

Originally Posted by cssnms

I disagree with your assesment behind the cause. In fact just about everything that you cited is a bi-product of their socialistic government. While true the government is to big, which is often the case with a socialistic government, Greece's debt crises has little to do with the fact their government employs to many people, as I said it's just a bi-product. The problems lie in an ideaology that a government's roll is to provide for the people. Greece continues to sponsor entitlement programs which it cannot afford, going into debt doing so, not much unlike what is happening in the UK and very much the direction this country is taking. That is why there is rioting, people do not want the government to take away the hand-outs. Laying off government employees is a short-term fix to a problem that runs much deeper. The fact they have "no real economy" is further evidence that a socialistic government does nothing to create jobs or bolster an economy, that's just smoke and mirrors.

cssnms, picking up what im putting down.

If you haven't deduced it from what ive said let me be more specific. Obama in HIS IDEOLOGY would prefer a system as flawed as the one in Greece, the parallels are uncanny. Trust me, im very well read in terms of philosophy and specifically the philosophies that go into coming to political and cultural affiliations. I wasnt trying to bash socialism, i was specific in saying that "type of socialism" because i wanted to highlight the fact that it was an ideology and not necessarily an economic system that is whats getting Greece into trouble.

The ideas that you yourself pointed out about the irresponsibility of the Greek system pervading the minds of its constituency is what im speaking of directly. No idea in economic philosophy or political philosophy is outright bad, its what is done under each. The reason i am economically conservative bordering on libertarian is because it leaves the least room for self destruction. The more pervasive the idea the larger chance of self destruction (not literally, ideologically), when that pervasive thinking is given authority it often times over extends itself into rubble, think Greece.

[Team Plutonium]

Originally Posted by txz4

cssnms, picking up what im putting down.

If you haven't deduced it from what ive said let me be more specific. Obama in HIS IDEOLOGY would prefer a system as flawed as the one in Greece, the parallels are uncanny. Trust me, im very well read in terms of philosophy and specifically the philosophies that go into coming to political and cultural affiliations. I wasnt trying to bash socialism, i was specific in saying that "type of socialism" because i wanted to highlight the fact that it was an ideology and not necessarily an economic system that is whats getting Greece into trouble.

The ideas that you yourself pointed out about the irresponsibility of the Greek system pervading the minds of its constituency is what im speaking of directly. No idea in economic philosophy or political philosophy is outright bad, its what is done under each. The reason i am economically conservative bordering on libertarian is because it leaves the least room for self destruction. The more pervasive the idea the larger chance of self destruction (not literally, ideologically), when that pervasive thinking is given authority it often times over extends itself into rubble, think Greece.

Dude, I'm not a fan of Obama, and I'm not a democrat, but this statement is just ridiculous. You know who increased our government by a huge f@cking margin? Bush and his republican administration. That was OK then? Give me a break...

[txz4]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Dude, I'm not a fan of Obama, and I'm not a democrat, but this statement is just ridiculous. You know who increased our government by a huge f@cking margin? Bush and his republican administration. That was OK then? Give me a break...

at what point did i EVER defend bush? Dont just make the assumption that im a mindless party member. I agree full heartedly that Bush expanded the gov by a wide margin and i think Obama was delighted with that as it was a mandate for his further expansion.

[Team Plutonium]

Point taken. But I don't think Obama saw this as a mandate to increase the government. But I think we both agree that this would be a big mistake.

[txz4]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Point taken. But I don't think Obama saw this as a mandate to increase the government. But I think we both agree that this would be a big mistake.

I think he did in a sense. sort of a "well if that guy could do what he did, im going to be able to do soo much with my fan base."

[ideliver]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Maybe it's because I'm German, but I will never understand why socialism is a bad thing? The last time I checked Germany is one of the very view countries on earth that is doing very well... they also built nice cars. People in the US also don't know what socialism is or means.... Germany, and scandinavian companies are all about profit as well, so capitalism and socialism can go hand-in-hand pretty well.

I love how the GOP prides itself with their christian values, but hates socialism, and in fact confuses it (on purpose) with communism. Fail all across the board.

If Japan would have left us alone things would be VERY different...if only

[ideliver]

Originally Posted by ghosthi32

so many people dont know what socialism truly is.

I do...and that's why I'm a libertarian...name one multicultural, multinational country with a government that does not censure or oppress some of it's people, some of the time

[ideliver]

Originally Posted by SehrSchnell

Dude, I'm not a fan of Obama, and I'm not a democrat, but this statement is just ridiculous. You know who increased our government by a huge f@cking margin? Bush and his republican administration. That was OK then? Give me a break...

It was not okay then. The TRUE conservatives worked against those expansions, ie Ron Paul...