Firearms

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by Dang3r

Thats nonsens to compare the rate of death by cars to the amount of dead people who got shot and relate this to the allowed pictures. Into some certain spaces and areas it makes sense to forbid firearms and its also not the dumbest idea to deny the sell and the ccw to some humans who are not be able to differ between this. Just saying...

I'm not sure I follow the first point - were you suggesting pictures should not be allowed? Or just that the two data points are not comparable?

I do tend to agree with your second point though - there are some extremely dumb humans out there who have no business carrying because I think they are dumb enough to use it, which means they go to jail, which means the taxpayers pay to support them, which doesn't seem fair to taxpayers. But given it is covered under the Second Amendment, not much you can do about these humans.

Plus, I think there are certain places where firearms can be prohibited - the White House for one example. No need for a firearm there by Joe Public.

On the flip side, I also understand the argument that an armed person is better able to protect him / herself against a criminal. I think the problem I would have is always second guessing myself in that circumstance as to whether I legally COULD shoot that person (if I were American) and that hesitation might be fatal to someone else or me. But certainly I agree with the point that criminals do not follow laws, therefore, outlawing guns will not prevent them from using them. So there is no point in outlawing guns.

While I enjoy using firearms, I struggle daily with whether I'd prefer to be allowed to carry up here, or keep existing laws. I really don't know which is better. Certainly when I'm out in the woods I'd feel more comfortable carrying for wildlife, but I've never had a situation where I felt uncomfortable in public or in any danger. Plus, even if I could carry, would I? I would imagine it is not always comfortable.

Anyways, I think people think you are a proponent of outlawing firearms, but I don't know that you are really saying that. And aren't you the one that asked about the possibility of getting a firearm for a few weeks while on vacation in USA and then selling it? And that you are reasonably proficient in their use?

[Dalko43]

Speaking of SCAR's, is anyone else here drooling over this anticipated release of the a civilian version of the SCAR Mk 20 ssr?

FN quality, 20" heavy profile barrel, semi auto piston system, gas regulator for suppressor use. It's supposedly capable of hitting point targets out to 1000 yards. The only things I'm not liking about it are the 1:12 twist rate (1:10 or 1:11 seems to be the new norm for .308 rifles, especially for shorter barrels) and the high probability of an exorbitant price. It's one of those firearms that might prompt me to move out of NY so that I can actually own one

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by KenB925

My SCAR 17 and AR after being raped by the CA DOJ

These still have their bullet buttons, I had to order a new spring for the SCAR, the bullet button spring is shorter then the spring used on the normal ambi mag release.

With the AR I am going to have to modify my bullet button wrench to get it out, I bought this rifle as a CA compliant rifle and they must have a different tool that makes it more difficult to change the mag release.

The changes are:
-non-adjustable stock, i put a new fixed stock on the AR, I don't like it, the length of pull is short. And just put a lego behind the button on the scar.
-Change out the 'flash hider' for a muzzle brake
-sharkfin on the grip so you can't wrap your thumb around it
-ambi safety on the AR (Standard on the SCAR) for convenience

In addition to the longer spring, I have also ordered a new longer and angled charging handle for the SCAR so I can swap it back to the other (non-ejection port) side so I can manipulate it with my 'weak' hand without bloodying my knuckles on the scope base.

I am considering a new stock on the SCAR, something with a QD would be nice.

Nice guns - so what are these new rules that you have to comply with - I think you mentioned something about "featureless". What does that mean and why do they think this is better?

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Nice guns - so what are these new rules that you have to comply with - I think you mentioned something about "featureless". What does that mean and why do they think this is better?

Featureless basically means the 'changes' I made.

For a rifle to be featureless, and therefore not dangerous? and illegal unless registered as an "assault rifle" in the state (different from federal reg) it can not have the following:
1 - Adjustable Stock
2 - Flash Hider
3 - grip that you can wrap your thumb around (pistol grip)
4 - Bayonet lug (i believe)
5 - Forward Grip (vertical forward grip)
6 - Grenade/Flare Launcher

I think thats it, but I welcome corrections.

If you register your rifle as an assault weapon (BS CA term) you still need to have the bullet button (my understanding of the bs law), and you can't sell or transfer the weapon. Meaning if you die it becomes property of the state. Hopefully we can get these laws stopped, but for now, I just won't wrap my thumb around the pistol grip or adjust the stock conveniently. The muzzle break doesn't bother me a bit...but they are loud.

They don't 'think' its better, they don't think at all. They try to ban the most common rifles that we have without banning all rifles (because they can't) and we find a way to comply with the BS laws and still keep our things without being accidental felons, and then they change the laws again.

Needless to say, the actual criminals don't bother with any of this.

[Joekerr]

Originally Posted by KenB925

Featureless basically means the 'changes' I made.

For a rifle to be featureless, and therefore not dangerous? and illegal unless registered as an "assault rifle" in the state (different from federal reg) it can not have the following:
1 - Adjustable Stock
2 - Flash Hider
3 - grip that you can wrap your thumb around (pistol grip)
4 - Bayonet lug (i believe)
5 - Forward Grip (vertical forward grip)
6 - Grenade/Flare Launcher

I think thats it, but I welcome corrections.

If you register your rifle as an assault weapon (BS CA term) you still need to have the bullet button (my understanding of the bs law), and you can't sell or transfer the weapon. Meaning if you die it becomes property of the state. Hopefully we can get these laws stopped, but for now, I just won't wrap my thumb around the pistol grip or adjust the stock conveniently. The muzzle break doesn't bother me a bit...but they are loud.

They don't 'think' its better, they don't think at all. They try to ban the most common rifles that we have without banning all rifles (because they can't) and we find a way to comply with the BS laws and still keep our things without being accidental felons, and then they change the laws again.

Needless to say, the actual criminals don't bother with any of this.

Ouch.

Well, in other news up here, you become an accidental felon if you happen to bring any Ruger 10/22 magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds out of your safe. The illogic behind this is that the RCMP suggest that while these magazines were designed for the rifle, they were also inherently designed to fit the pistol as well (and we have a ban on a pistol carrying more than 10 rounds).

So, in their wisdom, they declared the magazines (magazines mind you, not the actual guns) to be "prohibited devices" which means you need a prohibited license to transport (and at any rate, usually cannot use any prohibited firearms at any range in Canada anyway so there is no point, which means very few people have licences for prohibited firearms unless they were grandfathered in).

Absolute stupidity. Now everyone has to pin the magazines to 10 round max.

Lot of other stupid stuff going on too.

Does CA allow you to have fully automatic firearms? I think some states do right? Those btw, as you might have guessed, are also prohibited up here.

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

Ouch.

Well, in other news up here, you become an accidental felon if you happen to bring any Ruger 10/22 magazines that can hold more than 10 rounds out of your safe. The illogic behind this is that the RCMP suggest that while these magazines were designed for the rifle, they were also inherently designed to fit the pistol as well (and we have a ban on a pistol carrying more than 10 rounds).

So, in their wisdom, they declared the magazines (magazines mind you, not the actual guns) to be "prohibited devices" which means you need a prohibited license to transport (and at any rate, usually cannot use any prohibited firearms at any range in Canada anyway so there is no point, which means very few people have licences for prohibited firearms unless they were grandfathered in).

Absolute stupidity. Now everyone has to pin the magazines to 10 round max.

Lot of other stupid stuff going on too.

Does CA allow you to have fully automatic firearms? I think some states do right? Those btw, as you might have guessed, are also prohibited up here.

Not so fast, are laws are dumber!

CA also did a magazine ban, 10 rounds max, now possession is illegal, last year possession was legal (you could have old mags that you may have had for 15 years), and you could rebuild your old mags, not anymore. We also have to pin or otherwise block down our magazines to 10 round max.

[Hawkeye]

I believe you have to be LEO or NFA dealer to own an automatic. I looked into it a bit a while ago and I don't remember seeing any autos for less than $20k. It is more of a collector item than anything IMO.

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

I believe you have to be LEO or NFA dealer to own an automatic. I looked into it a bit a while ago and I don't remember seeing any autos for less than $20k. It is more of a collector item than anything IMO.

LEOs typically can't take their full autos home with them (at least thats my understanding from a SWAT buddy of mine).

In free states, pretty much anyone can own a full auto as long as its a registered NFA item. They are crazy expensive.

One thing that seems to be a 'work around' for full auto toys is being a licensed manufacturer. You can't sell them, at least not to 'normal' people, but you can build, have, and 'test' them. I'm not sure how much BS goes into that license, I'm sure its a lot.

[Fundguy1]

Originally Posted by KenB925

LEOs typically can't take their full autos home with them (at least thats my understanding from a SWAT buddy of mine).

In free states, pretty much anyone can own a full auto as long as its a registered NFA item. They are crazy expensive.

One thing that seems to be a 'work around' for full auto toys is being a licensed manufacturer. You can't sell them, at least not to 'normal' people, but you can build, have, and 'test' them. I'm not sure how much BS goes into that license, I'm sure its a lot.

Correct. Bump fire is also an option. And yes outlay is high for full auto but you get it back when you sell.

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by Fundguy1

Correct. Bump fire is also an option. And yes outlay is high for full auto but you get it back when you sell.

binary trigger is out there too

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by fbsm

Hate the triggers on those

H&K LEM trigger is far nicer

Originally Posted by Hawkeye

I believe you have to be LEO or NFA dealer to own an automatic. I looked into it a bit a while ago and I don't remember seeing any autos for less than $20k. It is more of a collector item than anything IMO.

$200 tax stamp and i think about the cheapest you can get into full auto for is about $9 - $10k for a MAC-9 type SMG. But once you get that, there are a plethora of uppers, long and short to modify it with.

Of course you need to live in a free state and will likely need to create a trust to hold the NFA item. I've you've got a suppressor or a SBR in a trust, you can likely get a MG. If you can afford it.

I've got a buddy who's got about $60k tied up in machine guns. He can likely sell them in a matter of a month or so for upwards of $110k. He didn't start buying machine guns until bout 6 years ago too. Prices just keep climbing. I like the idea, but i don't want to spend that much on a novelty item.

[Dang3r]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

I'm not sure I follow the first point - were you suggesting pictures should not be allowed? Or just that the two data points are not comparable?

I do tend to agree with your second point though - there are some extremely dumb humans out there who have no business carrying because I think they are dumb enough to use it, which means they go to jail, which means the taxpayers pay to support them, which doesn't seem fair to taxpayers. But given it is covered under the Second Amendment, not much you can do about these humans.

Plus, I think there are certain places where firearms can be prohibited - the White House for one example. No need for a firearm there by Joe Public.

On the flip side, I also understand the argument that an armed person is better able to protect him / herself against a criminal. I think the problem I would have is always second guessing myself in that circumstance as to whether I legally COULD shoot that person (if I were American) and that hesitation might be fatal to someone else or me. But certainly I agree with the point that criminals do not follow laws, therefore, outlawing guns will not prevent them from using them. So there is no point in outlawing guns.

While I enjoy using firearms, I struggle daily with whether I'd prefer to be allowed to carry up here, or keep existing laws. I really don't know which is better. Certainly when I'm out in the woods I'd feel more comfortable carrying for wildlife, but I've never had a situation where I felt uncomfortable in public or in any danger. Plus, even if I could carry, would I? I would imagine it is not always comfortable.

Anyways, I think people think you are a proponent of outlawing firearms, but I don't know that you are really saying that. And aren't you the one that asked about the possibility of getting a firearm for a few weeks while on vacation in USA and then selling it? And that you are reasonably proficient in their use?

Maybe I hadnt explain this too less but I was only talking about the two data points, pictures are not affected.
Oh, btw. I dont care about the White House, as a foreign I would never have access to it, but what about kindergardens, schools, hospitals and so on? Arent they worth it to be seen as weaponfree areas too? The reality says no, enough amok and shoot outs were happen.

Your "flip sided" point of view isnt really acceptable for me but this would lead into a endless spiral, which is started by "If only law enforcers are authorized to wear a gun, the rest of the crowd has to fight with sticks" and ends with the (probably) typical american answer "I demand to own and wear a gun because I can". So lets not hop into that train and let us deal with the actual situation.

Aside from that I possess a legal weapon owner card here but that means not, that I am a proponent for outlawing gun wear. My question was in that way, that I dont know the US-rules for buying guns as a foreign person. Following how about to buy one legal and sell it after the holiday. Thats not possible and end of the show.
The question should tell you more about thinking of public safeness for tourists across the states by travelling abroad v/s nearly everyone is allowed to buy and wear a gun and uses it for crime against other people, regardless of color and status.

[Dalko43]

Originally Posted by Dang3r

Aside from that I possess a legal weapon owner card here but that means not, that I am a proponent for outlawing gun wear. My question was in that way, that I dont know the US-rules for buying guns as a foreign person. Following how about to buy one legal and sell it after the holiday. Thats not possible and end of the show.

With the exception of NFA items (silencers, fully automatic weapons) and Federal NCIS background checks, firearm regulations vary widely state to state. But in most states, you must either be a legal resident or fully established citizen in order to purchase a weapon; and regardless of your status, you're still subject to the NCIS background check. So you might able to rent a few firearms at a range (again depending upon the state) but buying one as a temporary visitor isn't possible.


Also, fixed it for you:

Originally Posted by Dang3r

Your "flip sided" point of view isnt really acceptable for me but this would lead into a endless spiral, which is started by "If only law enforcers are authorized to wear a gun, the law-abiding crowd would fight with sticks while the criminals would fight with whatever weapons they want" and ends with the (probably) typical american answer "I demand to own and wear a gun because it's a constitutional right". So lets not hop into that train and let us deal with the actual situation.

If you don't want to hop into "that train" then don't bring up the topic, and more specifically I'd avoid misrepresenting how other societies and cultures view certain issues, like firearm ownership. There is a big difference for me personally between validating some action or behavior with the justification "because I can" and "because it's my individual right." I, or someone else, could hypothetically self-justify harming or otherwise interfering with someone else's life with the "because I can" argument; it's a broad and morally opaque logic. By contrast, when I espouse the concept of constitutional rights and liberties (freedom of speech, worship, protection against unreasonable search and seizures, right to own a firearm, ect.), I'm focused purely on my individual rights which, if exercised legally, have no bearing on other people's lives.

[Hawkeye]

Originally Posted by Dang3r

Maybe I hadnt explain this too less but I was only talking about the two data points, pictures are not affected.

Your first response was to a post I had saying that it was stupid to not just allow pictures of firearms everywhere on the forum. This discussion WAS 100% about pictures.

[KenB925]

Lets not have this thread degrade to a gun rights argument, send that over to the politics section. This one is for fun.

I was able to drill out one of my bullet button wrenches and get the stupid bullet button out of my AR, now a fully functional, fully legal featureless CA Rifle...until they change the rules again...

[Joekerr]

How often does everyone clean their handguns? After every time or after X number of rounds?

I have typically not cleaned mine after every use (since every use only constitutes about 100 rounds) so instead I try to make sure I take it down and clean it every 500.

Do people think that's too long an interval?

I was so pissed at myself - put an idiot scratch on the 1911 the first time I cleaned it - even though I knew about the idiot scratch, I still did it. It wasn't super bad, but I was still ticked off at myself.

[EJT86]

Originally Posted by Dalko43

With the exception of NFA items (silencers, fully automatic weapons) and Federal NCIS background checks, firearm regulations vary widely state to state. But in most states, you must either be a legal resident or fully established citizen in order to purchase a weapon; and regardless of your status, you're still subject to the NCIS background check. So you might able to rent a few firearms at a range (again depending upon the state) but buying one as a temporary visitor isn't possible.


Also, fixed it for you:


If you don't want to hop into "that train" then don't bring up the topic, and more specifically I'd avoid misrepresenting how other societies and cultures view certain issues, like firearm ownership. There is a big difference for me personally between validating some action or behavior with the justification "because I can" and "because it's my individual right." I, or someone else, could hypothetically self-justify harming or otherwise interfering with someone else's life with the "because I can" argument; it's a broad and morally opaque logic. By contrast, when I espouse the concept of constitutional rights and liberties (freedom of speech, worship, protection against unreasonable search and seizures, right to own a firearm, ect.), I'm focused purely on my individual rights which, if exercised legally, have no bearing on other people's lives.

Perfectly said

[KenB925]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

How often does everyone clean their handguns? After every time or after X number of rounds?

I have typically not cleaned mine after every use (since every use only constitutes about 100 rounds) so instead I try to make sure I take it down and clean it every 500.

Do people think that's too long an interval?

I was so pissed at myself - put an idiot scratch on the 1911 the first time I cleaned it - even though I knew about the idiot scratch, I still did it. It wasn't super bad, but I was still ticked off at myself.

Hate the idiot scratch! I have been able to avoid it.

I used to clean after every use but, with the exception of old school blued finish guns, now I go two or three.

I will not carry a gun that has been fired without cleaning it, you don't want to be the guy with a gun that has been fired, unless you had to fire it.

[Axius]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

How often does everyone clean their handguns? After every time or after X number of rounds?

I have typically not cleaned mine after every use (since every use only constitutes about 100 rounds) so instead I try to make sure I take it down and clean it every 500.

Do people think that's too long an interval?

I was so pissed at myself - put an idiot scratch on the 1911 the first time I cleaned it - even though I knew about the idiot scratch, I still did it. It wasn't super bad, but I was still ticked off at myself.

I do a basic cleaning pretty much after every trip. Mostly because I like tearing things apart and putting them back together. The AR always after every time because the last time I didn't, the BCG got caked up pretty good and ended up buying a replacement. Now just make sure it's got a nice saturation of oil all the time.

Longest I've gone in the SW 9mm was 400 rounds before cleaning, never had a misload/jam, and going on about 2k rounds through it now.

[Hawkeye]

I also do a basic field strip and clean after every trip. It's part of the fun for me.

Finally got out with my Five Seven. Love it! First mag grouping at 10 yards with blue tip (what I currently have for "self defense" ammo. Not sure how much I'll carry it due to size but the weight and my accuracy/consistency even without practicing.

Edit: for reference the target is about 3" across. Free standing, no rest.

[Hawkeye]

Additionally I highly recommend Black Rifle Coffee to any coffee fans. Just received and tried their Gunship beans and I'm a fan.

Probably nsfw commercial

[Mr Tonka]

Originally Posted by Joekerr

How often does everyone clean their handguns? After every time or after X number of rounds?

I have typically not cleaned mine after every use (since every use only constitutes about 100 rounds) so instead I try to make sure I take it down and clean it every 500.

Do people think that's too long an interval?

I was so pissed at myself - put an idiot scratch on the 1911 the first time I cleaned it - even though I knew about the idiot scratch, I still did it. It wasn't super bad, but I was still ticked off at myself.

Originally Posted by KenB925

Hate the idiot scratch! I have been able to avoid it.

I used to clean after every use but, with the exception of old school blued finish guns, now I go two or three.

I will not carry a gun that has been fired without cleaning it, you don't want to be the guy with a gun that has been fired, unless you had to fire it.

Originally Posted by Axius

I do a basic cleaning pretty much after every trip. Mostly because I like tearing things apart and putting them back together. The AR always after every time because the last time I didn't, the BCG got caked up pretty good and ended up buying a replacement. Now just make sure it's got a nice saturation of oil all the time.

Longest I've gone in the SW 9mm was 400 rounds before cleaning, never had a misload/jam, and going on about 2k rounds through it now.

I used to strip and clean after every shoot. Now i run a bore snake though, clean off any obvious cake and re-lube. I still do a full clean probably every 3rd shoot, but i clean with elbow grease and oil, don't use solvents unless absolutely necessary.

As far as carrying a gun that hasn't been cleaned. If it's any variant of a 1911, i whole heartedly agree. if it's a Glock, i stopped caring about that a while ago. I think i've shared before but the LGS shooting instructor got a new glock 19 and intended to shoot it straight out of the box without ever cleaning it until i wouldn't shoot anymore. He stopped counting after 10,000 rounds and estimates he's now past 30,000 rounds without cleaning it. No malfunctions.