E70 X5M Head.

[X5M_Midwest]

Anyone have to get a new head? dealership replaced my vanos and didnt fix the issue. They said I might need a new head!

[jandref321]

The whole cylinder head?! I feel like that is laziness. Im guessing any number of components could be to blame but they don't want to troubleshoot. You covered under warranty? What are the symptoms/codes?

[X5M_Midwest]

Originally Posted by jandref321

The whole cylinder head?! I feel like that is laziness. Im guessing any number of components could be to blame but they don't want to troubleshoot. You covered under warranty? What are the symptoms/codes?

3rd party company wont cover the repairs... its about a 12k repair.

i already paid 3k for the vanos repair. Engine malfunction.

[socale39]

I'd be checking the fine print of your 3rd party warranty before proceeding. If there is nothing in there that exempts the parts you are looking to or have already replaced, have your lawyer draft up a letter and they should fold pretty quickly.

[jandref321]

Originally Posted by socale39

I'd be checking the fine print of your 3rd party warranty before proceeding. If there is nothing in there that exempts the parts you are looking to or have already replaced, have your lawyer draft up a letter and they should fold pretty quickly.

x2...those aren't normal wear items (you could argue the vanos) so if they don't cover them then what is the warranty actually for?

[vioilio]

What is the exact issue and codes?

[JMD]

Originally Posted by jandref321

x2...those aren't normal wear items (you could argue the vanos) so if they don't cover them then what is the warranty actually for?

Exactly!

[eswimm]

Originally Posted by MinnesotaM3

Anyone have to get a new head? dealership replaced my vanos and didnt fix the issue. They said I might need a new head!

I've been through virtually the exact same situation. The problem is that they don't know what the real problem is and they're just throwing out parts to replace. The warranty company isn't going to cover a $12k repair that might be the problem, they only cover needed repairs.

In my case, over 2 years my engine ate 6 lifters, the warranty company replaced them to the tune of roughly $12k. In the last batch, a lifter that had failed once already failed again and the warranty company insisted that BMW replace that one under the 2yr 24k mile warranty. BMW refused saying they think the head is the problem and want to replace that.

Warranty company refused to replace the head without being told what is wrong with it.

Long story short, I paid $36 for the lifter out of pocket and the warranty company paid for the repair that included the 2nd lifter which hadn't failed before.

I then sold the car, because I knew it was only a matter of time before it failed again and neither my warranty company or BMW was going to cover it.

You need to find a mechanic that will actually figure out what the problem is instead of guessing. The BMW dealership just reads codes and replaced what the flowcharts say to replace. The head is next on the list because they don't know what's really wrong. If BMW could actually identify a problem with the head, it would most likely be covered and would have been in my case as well. Problem is, it's almost $4k in labor to remove the head and if they can't identify the actual problem the cost is on you. If they do find the problem once they get under there, the warranty company should cover it all.

[m5james]

The S63 doesn't have VANOS, the S63TU does...

[bimrologist]

Originally Posted by m5james

The S63 doesn't have VANOS, the S63TU does...

umm, every BMW engine since 1996 has VANOS...

[m5james]

My 1998 740iL doesn't have VANOS...that's simply not true. Sorry, I was thinking of Valvetronic though.

http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=548345

[bimrologist]

Unless you have a very early 1998MY build car, you have VANOS. I did misspeak by stating all engines from '96 have VANOS as the M60 was still in production at that point. However, stating that the S63 does not have VANOS is also incorrect.

[bimrologist]

Regardless, this issue has definitely peaked my interest. The fact that your dealer simply wants to replace a cylinder head without conclusive diagnosis is interesting to say the least?

[bimrologist]

Originally Posted by m5james

My 1998 740iL doesn't have VANOS...that's simply not true. Sorry, I was thinking of Valvetronic though.

http://f10.m5post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=548345

Not a problem, I was wrong myself!

[X5M_Midwest]

WOW!!! this is exactly the issue!

I had a engine malfunction pop up after backing out of a driveway! I wasnt even driving the car hard!

Dropped off the car at a independent BMW dealer. They fixed all the vanos and whatever else needed to be replace. Engine malfunction warning was still on. Independent company said I should bring it to BMW because they fixed everthing and it must be the ECU! ECU is under BMW warranty. Independent bmw shop asked me to sign off the paperwork so they would get paid by warranty company.

BMW replaced the ECU and it didnt fix anything! So we had to start from the beginning! they REDID all the Vanos exactly like Shop#1 after i showed them all the invoices and not to fix it because shop#1 already tried it. They charged me 3+k for the repair but it didnt fix it.

now they say the HEAD needs to be replaced! Warranty company is blaming bmw. Bmw said they did nothing wrong.

Anyways the new head replacement is 12k. I hired a lawyer to help me figure this out.

Originally Posted by eswimm

I've been through virtually the exact same situation. The problem is that they don't know what the real problem is and they're just throwing out parts to replace. The warranty company isn't going to cover a $12k repair that might be the problem, they only cover needed repairs.

In my case, over 2 years my engine ate 6 lifters, the warranty company replaced them to the tune of roughly $12k. In the last batch, a lifter that had failed once already failed again and the warranty company insisted that BMW replace that one under the 2yr 24k mile warranty. BMW refused saying they think the head is the problem and want to replace that.

Warranty company refused to replace the head without being told what is wrong with it.

Long story short, I paid $36 for the lifter out of pocket and the warranty company paid for the repair that included the 2nd lifter which hadn't failed before.

I then sold the car, because I knew it was only a matter of time before it failed again and neither my warranty company or BMW was going to cover it.

You need to find a mechanic that will actually figure out what the problem is instead of guessing. The BMW dealership just reads codes and replaced what the flowcharts say to replace. The head is next on the list because they don't know what's really wrong. If BMW could actually identify a problem with the head, it would most likely be covered and would have been in my case as well. Problem is, it's almost $4k in labor to remove the head and if they can't identify the actual problem the cost is on you. If they do find the problem once they get under there, the warranty company should cover it all.

[jandref321]

Originally Posted by MinnesotaM3

WOW!!! this is exactly the issue!

I had a engine malfunction pop up after backing out of a driveway! I wasnt even driving the car hard!

Dropped off the car at a independent BMW dealer. They fixed all the vanos and whatever else needed to be replace. Engine malfunction warning was still on. Independent company said I should bring it to BMW because they fixed everthing and it must be the ECU! ECU is under BMW warranty. Independent bmw shop asked me to sign off the paperwork so they would get paid by warranty company.

BMW replaced the ECU and it didnt fix anything! So we had to start from the beginning! they REDID all the Vanos exactly like Shop#1 after i showed them all the invoices and not to fix it because shop#1 already tried it. They charged me 3+k for the repair but it didnt fix it.

now they say the HEAD needs to be replaced! Warranty company is blaming bmw. Bmw said they did nothing wrong.

Anyways the new head replacement is 12k. I hired a lawyer to help me figure this out.

Maybe it's the same car

[eswimm]

Originally Posted by jandref321

Maybe it's the same car

Sure hope not. Mine was as Carbon Black 2010 X5M.

Sounds like the symptoms are different though, mine was a loud ticking noise, never through any engine codes or performed poorly.

I faced the same issue though for the 1st round of repairs. I was told if they didn't find a problem when the opened everything up, that I would be responsible for the labor. Since they found collapsed lifters, then the repair was covered.

Same thing for the head, if I had them remove the head and they discovered a clogged or damaged oil passage that was causing the lifters to fail, it'd have been covered. I wasn't going to agree to front $4k in labor hoping they found the problem though and I really wanted LED headlights anyway, so I made the jump to a 2013 X6M instead of dealing with the X5M anymore.

It was a problem child anyway, in the 2 years I had it, it was in the shop for 3 months to the tune of $18k in covered repairs.