Subaru WRX or STI as Daily

[RM7]

Originally Posted by F80Dreamer

I have owned wrxs in the past. As others have said, the Sti is just old tech with an ancient motor. New wrx is a much better overall car, better value, way better fuel efficiency. One thing to note is the acceleration times. If you look at the 5-60 mph times, they are very slow, like almost 6 seconds. So you have to really thrash the engine and clutch to get low 5s. I would look at the GTI over the Subie for sure.

Short gearing and turbo+awd makes them seem fast, but you'll realize that they are somewhat low on HP compared to some of the more mainstream cars, not to mention the drag of AWD.

I've seen subaru advertisements that said something like "don't compare our cars to others in terms of HP, compare the 0-60 times". It was misleading because it was those 5K clutch drop AWD launches that made the times what they were, and in real life, when not doing that, they weren't all that fast.

IMO, the WRX should be pushing out at least 300hp, the STI around 400. Subaru stagnates and is often the last to do certain things, for years they kept the horrible 4EAT in the forester XT, no twin scroll turbos for WRX/STI for years and years, no direct injection (finally with the 2.0, but it took a loooong time), and so on. As much fun as the WRX was for me, I'd probably look elsewhere.

If there was an equivalent car to something like the old 2004 STI, I'd probably go for that. IMO, that was as good as it got. Nice tight little car, nimble due to size, not super heavy, gripped like crazy, big difference between the WRX and it, and so on. I don't see the current STI in the same light at all. A co-worker offered to sell his to me with just a couple thousand miles, but I just wasn't interested.

Why not Focus RS? Ford seems a hell of a lot more serious than Subaru right now.

[FriskyDingo]

Meh, I'd guy a leftover 16 GTI.

I have one and I cross-shopped with new WRX and STI, and the performance advantage was just not worth the compromises- cheap interior, crappy ride, lack of refinement- for me. Especially with the STI. I was massively disappointed in that car. The throttle, power delivery, the just general enjoyment of driving it. All things considered, it was the biggest letdown of all the cars I drove, and would be the last one I'd buy with my own money (out of GTI, WRX, STI, Cooper S, Fo/FiST, even Civic Si).

But between your 2 choices, I'd go new WRX hands down. I'm really not a fan of the previous gen cars.

[aerostar]

I would go w/ the new DI WRX.

It's just as fast as a STI on the straights.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/new-cars...ru-wrx-vs-sti/

I doubt you'll notice the 0.4 seconds in a 1/4 mile. Also, buying a used STI is dangerous. 75% of them have been modified and of those 75%, about 50% have no idea what they're doing and don't tune them which causes massive issues later on down the road.

[eluded]

Don't buy used. Google ring land failure.

Delta between wrx and sti is $7500. A few years ago you could justify this. Upgraded suspension, the differentials, the brakes, all awesome PLUS the difference in motors. However nowadays one is modern direct injection motor pushing nearly as much horsepower as the sti's boat anchor. Personally, I wouldn't buy an STI since the motor is 10 years old (so I bought a f30)

[Mr Pete]

I've never driven a STI, but I do have a 05 WRX wagon as a daily. Picked up this beaut a few months ago, after driving my F80 in one winter. It did fine with snow tires, but decided I'd rather have AWD. And it had 59k miles when I got it, so couldn't really pass this up!

I want to say I fill up more in the WRX than I did with the F80 when I was daily driving it (my commute is about 35-37 miles round trip, 4 days a week). Fuel economy is quite poor for a 4cyl engine, and I'm driving quite conservatively.

If this is strictly a point A to point B type of car, any WRX would be good I bet, unless you can find a decent STI that hasn't been abused too much.

Best of luck!

[RM7]

Originally Posted by AWGroceryGetter

I've never driven a STI, but I do have a 05 WRX wagon as a daily. Picked up this beaut a few months ago, after driving my F80 in one winter. It did fine with snow tires, but decided I'd rather have AWD. And it had 59k miles when I got it, so couldn't really pass this up!

I want to say I fill up more in the WRX than I did with the F80 when I was daily driving it (my commute is about 35-37 miles round trip, 4 days a week). Fuel economy is quite poor for a 4cyl engine, and I'm driving quite conservatively.

If this is strictly a point A to point B type of car, any WRX would be good I bet, unless you can find a decent STI that hasn't been abused too much.

Best of luck!

The key is to keep it off of boost. I had a tune, but early shifting kept it all manageable and returned around 27-30 fairly easy. On a trip to CA over several hundred miles, I averaged 29, not bad for the speeds accross Arizona. The engine buzzes at way too high of an RPM though, both for comfort/hearing and mileage. But otherwise, not much difference than my N20. This all assuming you have a manual WRX. While an auto was offered, it wasn't really taken seriously by any of the people that appreciate subies. Terrible combination.

[M3Ronnie]

Had a 2016 Golf R Manual with DCC. I would have kept it but we don't need 2 manual cars. The R is more refined than the wrx. Great daily driver.

[paliknight]

Originally Posted by SSJTrunks523

We've owned an '11 STI and own a '15 STI Launch.

The new chassis/suspension is worlds better than the old one (so vote for new WRX)

The WRX is faster 0-60 than the STI due to 5spd vs 6pd. The shift point is at like 55-58mph or something stupid in the STI, killing the 0-60. 60-120 is a better measure. Vote WRX if you are keeping them stock.

STI tunes incredibly - cheap and easy, and pre-MY2012, they were much better built (motors). Our 2011 was bulletproof. Not so much the '15.

I'd say your big questions are:

1) how important is ride? if very - go new
2) Are you going to tune? - if yes, go STI. Saying a tuned WRX is as good as a stock STI is like saying a tuned Civic can be faster than a stock M3. Not fair comparison
3) If not tuning, how important is Warranty? - If not tuning, and/or warranty is important - go WRX
4) Hatch vs. Sedan - This is a personal "how much space do I need" question. STI/WRX

The new WRX's also have a 6 speed manual now. Not sure if its the same exact one as the STi though. But the older STI's still had engine issues. Probably nothing out of the ordinary, and most cars were fine, but still something to consider.

Originally Posted by ShocknAwe

With the above poster. STI if you will mod, WRX is keeping stock. Have driven them both, I really liked the WRX a lot for what it was.

Still, there are other cars I'd rather have more in the same market segment.

Actually, most Subie guys get the WRX if they're into modding since the Delta between a base WRX and an STi is around 10k, which when used towards mods, yields much better performance than Subaru offers for that difference.

[RM7]

Originally Posted by paliknight

Actually, most Subie guys get the WRX if they're into modding since the Delta between a base WRX and an STi is around 10k, which when used towards mods, yields much better performance than Subaru offers for that difference.

I think that's usually the dream, but rarely does it work out like that. Pricing out some stuff:

Stage 1 cobb power+intake=970.
Eibach Pro-plus kit=510 or so
Additional reinforced bushings/endlinks, etc=300 or so
Shocks (bilstien?)=750 at least
Big brake kit around 3-4K
Exhaust+downpipe, around 1.5K
Bigger intercooler?
I don't know how the 2.0L and 2.5L turbos compare anymore, but on the old WRXs, the turbo was tiny, pumping it up via a tune and exhaust/intake built more power quicker, but it ran out of steam faster too, so you wouldn't pull much at higher RPMs, where the STI would keep pulling due to ability to move more air.

Wheels and tires? To at least match the STI? STI is running 18x8.5, WRX is on 17x8 for the equivalent models.

Then after this, and these parts don't install themselves, it still doesn't have the same transmission, clutch, all of the other suspension bits, and so on. I'd submit that to systematically go in and switch all of these parts, would cost a lot more than 10K, again, IF you really wanted to do it. At the same time, you could likely replace the parts with "better than STI", but the car is only as good as it's weakest link, so you'd need to change out everything that's different, a lot of little things.

If tracking the car is the purpose, I'd say the STI is still far better. The only reason to do the WRX would be to try and spread out the cost. In the end, you'll spend more money, but sometimes it's worth it to some people to spread out the cost. The STI comes ready and basically just needs some track tires and race-pads. The WRX is likely plenty competitive at lower levels/autocross, but not the track-ready machine that the STI is. You're not paying for the extra 30hp, you're paying for all the little improvements all over the car that make it better. The only thing is that in this day and age, the STI should be pushing out at least 350hp at the crank, should have a gear to bring the engine RPM down for the highway, should have magnetic suspension or some sort of adjustable available, should have a completely forged DI engine, should have a turbo that doesn't take spooling up to 2800 to build serious boost, option for active cruise control/collision detection, should have all the modern stuff you can get in competitor's cars and other subarus, should have a hatch/wagon option (well, that's just me, I thought my wagon was a hoot and the 2008 was a great idea for practicality).

But, all that said, what would be wicked is a boxer engine, low and BEHIND the front axle, driveshaft to a rear differential, with electric motors at the front wheels, to maintain the AWD. That would absolutely take the cake and kill the engine-in-front-of-the-front-axle problem. All sorts of mods can increase the limit, but they can't change the fact that at the limit, this thing is a handful, trying to understeer and then snap-oversteer on you. I'm sure we'll see cars like this in a few years.

[Blksnowflake]

I know you talked about STIs and WRXs...
You won't find a better more fun car than an Evo X. Read any comparison review between all those models and the Evo always wins.
Cons: gas mileage just like the STI
And trunk space is minimal.

I've owned both, Evo is way more fun but I have a childhood love affair with STIs. The new WRX chassis and motor wise have come a long way...and WRXs have had better gearing for 0-60 since the last gen, but there is no comparison. If you think a WRX compares to an STI...then I suppose in that vain none own an M as they also believe a 340i is a better car than an E92 M3....hint, it's not.

[Vortexginge]

Go the Ford Focus RS .Its amazing and a hardcore apex predator!
Failing that a GTI with a software upgrade the new performance variant is nice and nimble and a great place to be in during that daily commute complemented with the odd angry moment
I should feel some movement downstairs but it doesnt matter how hard i try i cant get excited about a WRX

[SSJTrunks523]

Originally Posted by paliknight

The new WRX's also have a 6 speed manual now. Not sure if its the same exact one as the STi though. But the older STI's still had engine issues. Probably nothing out of the ordinary, and most cars were fine, but still something to consider.


Actually, most Subie guys get the WRX if they're into modding since the Delta between a base WRX and an STi is around 10k, which when used towards mods, yields much better performance than Subaru offers for that difference.

The new STIs are plagued with engine issues. Ask any local tuner. Not to say that motors didn't blow, or don't blow while tuning. The rate has just gone way up in the past couple years.

Having owned an '11 hatch and a '15, and yes I know it is just a 1 off, everyone says we should have kept the '11. I have friends with '09, '11, '13 and '10 wrx. 2.5RS's. Lots of fun stuff. Sad to say we are looking at moving away from the subaru family as even our new family truckster outback is having issues already. The QC is just completely gone. They kept the ej257 long past its prime for the tuning market, and have let it slip. While being lazy about that, they started becoming lazy about QC.

Look up 2015 STI Rod Bearings. It's like a S65-fest over there Guys are scared to look sideways at the thing. Many keep it stock now or move on to another platform.

The pistons have always been weak above ~400whp. That 400whp, with a brand new car, is going to set you back ~$42-45k all in. Separate issue, and if you want 500hp+AWD and have the dough, get a used 2012+ low mileage GTR for ~$60k.

The WRX is good for street, stock, light mods. New drivetrain in it now is supposedly far superior (haven't driven a new one) and the chassis/suspension is MUCH better than before (which I can tell you from the '15 STI). The STI is the base to build on. I've never heard anyone I know buy a WRX over an STI because they were going to "modify it anyways".

Remember the 2.0 v 2.5l as well. The STI is considered a cheater motor vs the Evo X because they broke class specs and went up in size. We you are talking 200hp/L, .5L matters.

As for interior - the car is still an Impreza. Everyone who asks me I tell them this: My M3 is a $75k car built on a $40k base (3-series, and yes I know 80% of the parts are different or whatever. Just roll with it). The STI is a $40k car built on an $18k base. You can't ever expect the STI to be anything more that a faster, flashier $18k car. Cheap plastics, poor electronics, eh seats (although our '11 had MUCH better seats. no idea what option the wife chose back then).

I second the Focus RS if you can get one at MSRP. Was looking at them before I got my M. Do they make it in anything besides that Robin Egg Blue?

Evo X has been a dream addition for a decade.....one day. maybe 6th or 7th car in the garage or replace my 328 for DD duty.