X5 e70 35d, dde no communication

[Egough1]

I have been chasing this problem for a while. The car was running a little sluggish. Knowing that it was in need of a fuel filter... I proceeded to change it. Had a couple of hiccups on restart. Figured it was air. Took it on a 20 mile drive with no more issues.
Wife drove it the next day and it died on her about a mile from the house. She got it restarted and made it almost home when it died and she coasted into the driveway. I at the time had no way to scan it properly. So I ordered a Foxwell 530 with the BMW package. I figured it got another slug of air from the filter change, and the foxwell allows me to purge the system. After purging the system. I read all the codes which seemed to me like a bunch of things tied to it dying from air. I cleared all the codes and started it. Let it idle for 10 min like the purging instructions said. Test drove it all was well.

Went back out about 10 min later everything seemed normal, but crank nostart. Then it started popping all sorts of things across the screen going wrong with trans, x-drive, leveling sys...

Connected the scanner to pull codes again. It would not recognize that there was even a DDE in the car. All other codes were non communication codes with the DDE. There was one code in the CAS system that stood out for a starter. All the research i could find on this code was a ground strap problem. My ground strap didn't look bad, but i built a new ground cable and installed anyways.

Scanned again. It saw the DDE. Had a few codes. Cleared everything again. Started right up after a minute or so warm up. Took it for another test run. Came home parked. everything was wonderful. Went inside to get the kids. Came out no start agian with all the same things popping up on the console. Connected the scanner and again no communication.

Have went through checking grounds. Have replaced both relays in the compartment with the DDE. Replaced battery. Checked all fuses. Have rubbed the harness looking for a rubbed spot on everything I can reach. I have even pulled all connections from the DDE and inspected them, cleaned them, and made sure connections were tight. And every time i do something check the scanner it will read the DDE. I will drive it. Shut it off. BAM same stuff. NO COMMUNICATION. I am pulling my hair out and I dont have a lot left to pull on.

Could someone please give me some advice as to where to check next.

[Dextrous]

Any progress with this?

My 2013 X5 35D has literally the exact same issue, it's gotten to the point where its now happening multiple times per trip as opposed to once a week or so.

I also have a "P0685 engine control relay - open circuit" code in addition to the others, haven't really had time and the cold weather has put me off digging deeper.

I'm thinking its an electrical issue somewhere, bad ground, week signal voltage to the relay or a faulty relay, my next step is to find the ground point for the DDE.

[Dextrous]

Checked all my relays and grounds, they're all good. Started removing my DDE and found plug modul 4 had some diesel fuel in there and the wires coming into the dde compartment were all wet with diesel fuel.



Did some research, found that the temp/fuel pressure sensors tend to fail and leak into the plug connector, checked the plug and found it to be dry.

Anyways, couldn't really find where the fuel was coming from but cleaned everything with contact cleaner, blew it dry and the cars been running without issues so far.

[Dextrous]

Okay, so that wasn't the issue car is getting considerably worse, it almost wont even start or stay running now.

Ended up buying a new DDE relay (the blue relay) I'm assuming, swapped it and no change, noticed the other relay in the DDE compartment was clicking intermittently.

Checked the leads of the relay with my meter

Pin 30 is getting constant 12v from the battery, tests good.
Pin 85 and 86 show 12v when ignition is turned on.
Pin 87 is reading 3.33v (or 1.33v in Low impedance mode,) and it will randomly click and show 12v, and when it reads 12v the car runs fine.

Now I'm wondering what this relay is for, it gets routed into the harness and either goes through the firewall on the passenger side or down into the engine bay.

I checked pin 87 of the relay with power wires under the passenger glove box for continuity and couldn't find where it goes, so I'm thinking it doesn't go to the fuse box there. I doubt its for the EKP as its getting a 12v supply with that relay disconnected.


I tested 3 other relays I had on hand and they all did the same thing, I doubt all 3 are bad, one thing to consider is they are not brand new I pulled them from vehicles I scrapped.


Any help would be appreciated, I wish I could find some electrical diagrams of this car.

[madbim]

working though the exact same issue on my 13' 35d. I just discovered module 4 was full of diesel. Did you ever get this resolved or find the source of the issue?

[Dextrous]

Figured I'd update my findings for anyone else interested, removed my upper intake manifold to get access to the low pressure fuel line that also has a temp/pressure sensor, removed the connecter and found diesel in there, so need a new low pressure line.

Opened the DDE which was a pain, sprayed it with contact cleaner to get rid of the excess diesel, didn't see any physical damage on traces or any components so I'm hoping the DDE is still good.

Waiting on a low pressure line but I'm confident the diesel in the connecter or DDE was causing an intermittent short.

I found electrical information as well, the only thing touching diesel fuel on x20008 is the fuel temp/pressure sensor.

[Dextrous]

Pictures of the DDE once opened, there is a thin film of diesel on everything, hard to see in the pic.

[madbim]

I can confirm the same exact issue on my 13' 35d.

No crank no start, all kinds of warnings on the iDrive. No communication with the DDE, module 4 was wet with diesel. Pulled the intake manifold tonight to get to the low pressure fuel line and sure enough the electrical connector was wet with diesel.

[Dextrous]

Replaced the low pressure fuel line, re-installed everything and all seemed well for a day until it turned off on me again the next day.

I was getting a fault for DDE main relay fault, so I jumped the DDE relay on, turned the car on and it died on me this time with 46C0 DDE controller internal (MoCComErrCnt) fault.

I guess the diesel fuel damaged the DDE, I'll be sending it out for cloning.

This is quite a catastrophic failure for a leaking fuel/temp sensor. I see BMW has made a service bulletin for the G30 (5 Series 540d xDrive) found here, https://static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/20...54822-9999.pdf

[robinasu]

Crazy. How does the fuel get in the DDE enclosure? Capillary action?

[Dextrous]

Originally Posted by robinasu

Crazy. How does the fuel get in the DDE enclosure? Capillary action?

Apparently so.

Makes me a little scared that this can happen again, but I don't think this is that common of a problem. Makes me want to order another DDE and clone it just in case it happens again and DDE's become harder to find.

[robinasu]

Bad luck, buddy. Sorry about that. Maybe you can wrap something around the wires as some kind of dam. Just thinking out loud, here.

[dsj1000]

Unfortunately, I am experiencing the exact same malfunction with my '13 X5 35d, with 112K miles. Could not see the DDE with my laptop connected to the car. I called a tow and had the car taken to the local BMW dealer. They called me this morning and informed me they found the DDE contaminated with diesel, and shorted out. More investigation coming on Monday.

Until this malfunction happened - I loved my X5 diesel!

What's the latest with your repair?

If I need a new DDE - where can I find one reasonably priced?

Thanks for any updates.

[Dextrous]

Originally Posted by dsj1000

Unfortunately, I am experiencing the exact same malfunction with my '13 X5 35d, with 112K miles. Could not see the DDE with my laptop connected to the car. I called a tow and had the car taken to the local BMW dealer. They called me this morning and informed me they found the DDE contaminated with diesel, and shorted out. More investigation coming on Monday.

Until this malfunction happened - I loved my X5 diesel!

What's the latest with your repair?

If I need a new DDE - where can I find one reasonably priced?

Thanks for any updates.

So I ordered a used DDE from Europe but it wasn't for a M57, luckily I was able to return it, I've tried reflowing the board by throwing it in the oven with no luck, I'm going to throw it in the oven at a low temp for an extended time in hopes to get any diesel out of any chips or component internals.

If that doesn't work I'll have to go to the dealer and buy a brand new DDE for roughly $2000. Used ones are going for $1000 plus shipping on ebay, plus you need to send your unit out and the used unit for cloning which will end up costing more, I may as well go with a brand new unit from BMW that is warrantied.

[crystalworks]

Wow. After just (hopefully) completing my 1.5 year long transmission replacement on our M57, this is one more thing to worry about. Wonder if cutting some of the wire loom would be good preventative action for this failure? One could cut out a small section of loom so the diesel would drip out instead of continuing on it's journey to the DDE.

Thank you all for sharing/documenting this issue.

[Dextrous]

I think the best solution would be removing the rubber seal inside the plug for the fuel temp/pressure sensor, it will drip out right there, hopefully.

[crystalworks]

Possibly. I might just split the loom and make a weep hole at a low spot for piece of mind. Hopefully the harness is accessible without too much effort.

Side note... damn that vacuum distribution block being under the manifold. Just replaced those front 2 lines without pulling the manifold. Wanted to do the rest, but after replacing my transmission (whole thing), motor mounts, guibos, rear main seal, pressure converters, DPF cleaned, vacuum lines, and fuel filter... I was not in any mood to pull the intake.

[Matrixsig]

Dextrous
I have the exact same issue and found both the low pressure fuel temp sensor part# 13-53-7-806-960 as well as the high pressure Fuel Quantity Control Valve part# 1465ZS0097 both full of diesel. I've replaced the control value already and waiting on the other part. DDE I was able to remove the board and clean it then used a heat gun and it appears to be working again. My question is could there be any other item that caused this that could have just pushed the fuel to those two parts? I've check the connectors at each injector and they are dry. Also did your replacing the low pressure fuel supply line correct the problem. I'm concerned because the loom connected to that sensor shows about 1/2 inch of the wire before going into the loom. Not sure I understand how the fuel got to the DDE.

[Matrixsig]

Seems like the replacement of both those parts was the fix. I did have to reflash my FRM module and thankfully I have the equipment to do that as it was non-functional after I hooked everything back. I ended up putting some small holes in the once airtight DDE box with the thinking that somehow it was creating a vacuum and I didn't want more fuel that could be in the loom to make its way back up into the DDE. So far everything seems to be working well. I took this time to also clean my intake manifold, EGR, and replace vacuum lines. driving great again and gas mileage is back to when I first got it. Just in time with price of diesel being what it now is... Hope this helps in case this happens to anyone else. very frustrating to track down the cause.

[unematt]

@Matrixsig How did you remove the PCB from the back plate? I have the same issue but could only clean the top of the PCB so far.

[RL18]

The dde box is “sealed” but not completely sealed. It has vents inside of it. I know this because theres a drain on that side in the fender well that plugged on me and filled my dde box with water when it rained. Eventually working it’s way in through the covering on my dde and frying it.

If your dde got wet with diesel. You’ll likely need to change the dde and the wiring from those sensors. The diesel won’t necessarily short anything but it can cause a short over time by breaking things down like the wire insulation and such. It’s possible that you could try using a contact cleaner on the dde and it be okay, but at the very least I would say the wiring that came into contact with the diesel needs to be changed not just the sensor

[hartwa]

I got the same issue... Stalling sometimes...Been throwing the DDE Main relay code and a lot of various communication issues like... "No Message reviver DSC transmitter DME-DDE.

Pulled out the DDE and found Mod 4 connection fuel of diesel. I have it setting upside down now with paper towel underneath it. Still leaving green diesel on the towel this morning.

Since the car was running when I took it out I wonder if I might just replace the fuel line and sensor without trying to clean the DDE. My thinking is that the DDE is working right now...should I press my luck spraying contact cleaner in there and messing something up? I might be better off leaving it drain a few days.???