Your Transmission Fluid is NOT "LIFETIME"

[Sophisticated Redneck]

I posted this originally in the F15 forums and wanted to Post this to here also to clear-up some confusion created by BMW marketing. As you know, All E70s comes with either 6 or 8 Speed Automatic transmissions. These are not manufactured by BMW, But rather ZF Friedrichshafen AG.

It is very important to understand that you need to change your Transmission oil and filter every 50 to 70 thousand miles. BMW marketing is doing everyone a great disservice by claiming the fluid is "lifetime" which is nothing more then a marketing gimmick.

Attached is the guidelines and Procedures from ZF themselves on changing the fluid in which it clearly states every 80-120k km (50 to 75K Miles) Also below is a video from ZF directly calling out BMW on their "Lifetime" marketing BS.

If you have the original fluid in your transmission and you are past 75K, please change it ASAP as your transmission is already experiencing accelerated wear which will inevitable become obvious when you start to notice hard rough shifts/delayed shifting and then finally drive train errors in the near future.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

[ryansbmw]

Yea I’m at 102k and will be doing mine shortly. My Indy is recommending to replace a bunch of other seals during this process that aren’t included in the maintenance kits-new pan, fluid, bolts. Any input on this? I’m not seeing any info about this on any of the forums,

[sunny_j]

I would replace all the seals and use zf fluid

[Sophisticated Redneck]

I second what SunnyJ said, replace all Mechatronics seals and use zf fluid while you have them in there. Also by taking off the valve body to replace the seals, it allows a more complete drain and more fluid will be replaced.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

I will add that is you want to go all out and have the money, replace all of the solenoids too. You will easily get another 100k+ miles out of the transmission. I only reccomend it though as preventative maintenance if you plan on keeping it for years to come as you very well get another 50k+ out of the stock solenoids before they start to fail. Much depends on how much city driving (shift cycles)it had during it's life.

[Lviv777]

Going to have to strongly consider doing this. What are the prices that you guys are getting quoted by indy shops?

[ryansbmw]

Originally Posted by Lviv777

Going to have to strongly consider doing this. What are the prices that you guys are getting quoted by indy shops?

I got quoted ~$700.

~$500 for pan, seals, and fluid.
~$200 for labor

[Nkponder]

I have a question on this subject; my X5 has 134k miles and I asked my mechanic about doing a fluid and filter change. He recommended NOT doing it as he is concerned that it could cause slippage and increased wear on the transmission and clutch plate. He says that the fluid contains tiny metal fragments that have worn loose and that the fluid with the micro shavings are filling in gaps from wear. Is he correct and should I not do a fluid and filter swap? Currently, I have no issues with my transmission, just trying to take car of my ride.

Thanks in advance for advice and input!

[Lviv777]

Originally Posted by Nkponder

I have a question on this subject; my X5 has 134k miles and I asked my mechanic about doing a fluid and filter change. He recommended NOT doing it as he is concerned that it could cause slippage and increased wear on the transmission and clutch plate. He says that the fluid contains tiny metal fragments that have worn loose and that the fluid with the micro shavings are filling in gaps from wear. Is he correct and should I not do a fluid and filter swap? Currently, I have no issues with my transmission, just trying to take car of my ride.

Thanks in advance for advice and input!

Same position as me and same advice that my mechanic gave a few months back.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Nkponder

I have a question on this subject; my X5 has 134k miles and I asked my mechanic about doing a fluid and filter change. He recommended NOT doing it as he is concerned that it could cause slippage and increased wear on the transmission and clutch plate. He says that the fluid contains tiny metal fragments that have worn loose and that the fluid with the micro shavings are filling in gaps from wear. Is he correct and should I not do a fluid and filter swap? Currently, I have no issues with my transmission, just trying to take car of my ride.

Thanks in advance for advice and input!

That is some old-school knowledge your mechanic has, I've heard that before and always considered it more wives-tale then fact but doesn't apply to the ZF. Your transmission pan has magnets on multiple sides, trapping all metallic particles in the fluid. They are very effective as you will see when you pull the pan as you need to clean them and transfer them to the new pan(some oil change kits do come with new).

I highly recommend you follow what ZF recommends but if you still have concerns, you may want to speak direct to one of their engineers, you can email them from a link on their web page, they are very responsive.

[aligoodn]

In older automatic transmissions that had been neglected, changing the fluid had a decent chance of resulting in a slipping clutches. In these cases, the clutches inside the transmission had already worn out but the grit in the trans fluid was providing enough friction to keep the transmission from slipping badly. That grit in the fluid is also causing excessive wear of every other part inside the transmission. The advice to not change the fluid is based on the fact that the shop doesn't want to get blamed for causing the transmission to slip excessively after the fluid change and end up getting sued and forced into eating the cost of replacing the transmission.

Honda automatic transmissions were notorious for doing this, especially in early Odysseys. In that case, Honda recommended the first transmission fluid change at 105k miles, the filter was not replaceable without splitting the transmission case (so it was never changed), and the cooler was way undersized which resulted in very high transmission temps. By this time in life, especially for a city driven Odyssey, the fluid was beyond burned and the second gear clutches were basically destroyed. Honda settled as part of a class action lawsuit and agreed to extend powertrain warranties on Odysseys beyond the 100k. Funny that the first fluid change was recommended after the warranty initially expired. Interesting parallel to BMW and lifetime fluids.

Older automatic transmissions did not have the capacity to change shift pressures in response to wearing clutches. The ZF gearboxes in our cars (and pretty much every modern automatic) learn and store adaptations which keep the shift quality constant until the clutches wear to the point where the transmission can no longer compensate. The unintended consequence of this is that you will get zero indications that the transmission is on its last legs until it fails, unlike older automatics where you could feel the shifts get softer and softer. You can't use the "my trans feels fine" thought process with these transmissions because of the capability to adapt. After the fluid is changed, there is a re-learn procedure that can either be initiated with ISTA or just drive the vehicle a few hundred miles and it will adapt. Expect the transmission to do some odd things for the first few shifts with fresh fluid as the control modules adapt to the lubricity of the fresh fluid.

IMO, I would always change the fluid if I plan to keep the car long term even if the initial mileage is high. If the trans starts to slip, it means you were on borrowed time anyways. Used lower mileage transmissions can be sourced for a few grand from LKQ or other salvage parts vendors.

[RL18]

Anyone mind posting part # for the seals and solenoids? Or even a parts list

I have and pan and filter already here. Thinking I'll get that done on my x5 after I do all my engine maintenance to it. My indy shop quoted me about the same for the job.

[Lunker325]

Interesting read here, thanks to all for sharing.

I'm at 76K miles, probably about the right time for me to do this?

[X5 MAN]

What does the BMW gain by not changing transmission fluid ?

Apart from possible slippages later on which they can deny responsibility ?

ZF vs BMW ., who can you trust ?

Just my 2 cents

[Nkponder]

Awesome, thanks for the info guys!

I didn't really like the info I was getting from my mechanic regarding the transmission, but he's done me right on other repairs.

[Nkponder]

Follow up question; what do y'all think of doing an xHP transmission tune on a vehicle.with 134k miles?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by RL18

Anyone mind posting part # for the seals and solenoids? Or even a parts list

I have and pan and filter already here. Thinking I'll get that done on my x5 after I do all my engine maintenance to it. My indy shop quoted me about the same for the job.

Sure, let me know the last 7 of your VIN and I can post the part numbers, I will warn ya though, the solenoids for the 8HP are very hard to find, they have been backordered multiple times. Took me months to get mine.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Lunker325

Interesting read here, thanks to all for sharing.

I'm at 76K miles, probably about the right time for me to do this?

Yep perfect time! Check out FCP Euro for great oil/filter combos

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Nkponder

Follow up question; what do y'all think of doing an xHP transmission tune on a vehicle.with 134k miles?

I would LOVE to do the xHP tune on mine and I am over 150K, they dont offer it for the 8HP in the 50i for my year =(

[Nkponder]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

I would LOVE to do the xHP tune on mine and I am over 150K, they dont offer it for the 8HP in the 50i for my year =(

So you have no concern of flashing a higher mileage transmission?

It's not compatible with the 50i? They're online compatibility says the 50i is supported?

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by X5 MAN

What does the BMW gain by not changing transmission fluid ?

Apart from possible slippages later on which they can deny responsibility ?

ZF vs BMW ., who can you trust ?

Just my 2 cents

I don't really understand their logic either other then a marketing selling point and perhaps saving a few dollars per car not having to add a dipstick?

Well I for one will trust ZF, they after all the ones who designed and make the transmission. If you watch the video, they directly call out BMW and the stickers they put on the transmissions claiming its "lifetime" Lifetime of the factory warranty they mean, not the transmission. The PDF clearly states 50 to 75K too and if you speak to them direct, they will tell you BMW is wrong and their transmissions need oil changes no later then 75K or 8 Years, which ever comes first.