Advise please: 11 X5M with 130K, help a noob.

[Esdras_R]

Hello everyone,

Been looking for a while and it seems pretty hard to find X5M's with over 130k,

A little about myself, 33, currently stationed in NY, fly stuff for a living. I have had a fair bit of basic maintenance experience with previous vehicles. Have had Fords, Infinitis, GM's, Dodge, and even a Wrangler. Few motorcycles, most recent is a monster, which I have maintained for the past few years.

I am mechanically inclined and seem to understand basic maintenance needs for an X5.

About the vehicle: It's a Red 2011 with 130K. Bought by a dealership owner from the second owner who had it since 2012 up to about 110k. He has receipts for work from a BMW dealer for about 11k worth of work in the past 4 months. Work includes new valve cover gaskets, oil pan seal, oil pump seal, new transfer case, new water pump and seal, and a new set of rear run flats. He's been driving it from about 110k until now at 130k. All his work was covered by a warranty that he sells though his dealership. I would also get a new policy starting from the date of purchase for 3 years/36k for power train, electrical, and drive assembly from ASC warranty.

The price is 17,500

What are your thoughts? I can afford a few thousand at once for a big repair, with no issue, but would rather not spend 17k to buy and end up spending another 17k in two years for repairs. I feel confident I can do basic maintenance and upkeep including minor repairs on my own. I would just have to get back to turning wrenches, which I'm cool with
What are things I should expect to break soon? lifespan of turbos? suspension? big ticket items?

Should I just wait? go with an SRT8?

I really appreciate any help, like I said, I have spent hours looking for info on these with high miles, it's been tough.

[predicate_logic]

I was in a similar situation about 2 years ago, and ended up buying a 2010 X5M with 117K miles on it.

Before I bought it, I paid for 3 separate car inspections from different idependent mechanics. There were only a few minor issues.

Every mechanic cautioned me that maintenance was going to be needed soon, and probably gonna be expensive since everything in the car was still original from the factory.

I decided to buy the car anyway.

I already had some money set aside for maintenance, and was OK with setting aside money for maintenance every month.

Here's a list of all the preventative matintenance I did over the past 2 years:

- replaced both turbos
- replaced 1 turbocharger water pump
- replaced all valve stem seals
- walnut blasted the intake valves
- replaced fuel injectors
- replaced vacuum pump
- replaced coolant expansion tank
- replaced CCV breather line
- replaced various hoses and clamps
- flushed various fluids (coolant, power steering, etc)
- new engine mounts
- new spark plugs
- new ignition coils
- bought 4 new tires
- performed oil change every 3K miles

All of these fixes were preventative (nothing in the car was actually broken).

In my opinion, it was 100% worth it. The car is fun to drive, and it run so smooth.

[X5 MAN]

I was in a similar situation in June 2018 except it was not X5M but 50i

bought a 2011 with 95k miles on it for 15k $$

Updated all the wear and tear parts , coils , plugs, struts, thermostat, MAF sensor, etc.. and Battery and wheels.

Now on 125k miles with no problems .

The 50i is cheaper to maintain then a X5M with almost similar horse power , adequate for the Interstate.

X5M is an overkill unless driving over 100mph

[Esdras_R]

Thanks for the reply! What I think a plus is for this one is that it is all stock and the warranty has proven to actually pay out when needed. I don't plan on modding. I plan on having a PPI from a local shop that has a good rep, there is no BMW close by to take it to for an inspection, it's a small town in Alabama that I found it at during while down here for some training

predicate_logic, how many miles do you have now? Are the turbos remove and replace or should it be done by a shop? How intensive was the valve stem seal job? cost?
I think if spaced over two years, it wouldn't be so bad.

X5 man, I don't drive 100 everywhere, but I like getting to the speed limit quickly Your cost doesn't seem nearly as high or bad as some would make it seem.

[X5 MAN]

Originally Posted by Esdras_R

Thanks for the reply! What I think a plus is for this one is that it is all stock and the warranty has proven to actually pay out when needed. I don't plan on modding. I plan on having a PPI from a local shop that has a good rep, there is no BMW close by to take it to for an inspection, it's a small town in Alabama that I found it at during while down here for some training

predicate_logic, how many miles do you have now? Are the turbos remove and replace or should it be done by a shop? How intensive was the valve stem seal job? cost?
I think if spaced over two years, it wouldn't be so bad.

X5 man, I don't drive 100 everywhere, but I like getting to the speed limit quickly Your cost doesn't seem nearly as high or bad as some would make it seem.

Believe me, the 50i reaches speed limit pretty quickly before the cops latch on to your tail

Difference between X5M and 50i reaching speed limit maybe just a couple of seconds

But the cost of parts and repairs between the two may be hundred percent

[Esdras_R]

Originally Posted by X5 MAN

Believe me, the 50i reaches speed limit pretty quickly before the cops latch on to your tail

Difference between X5M and 50i reaching speed limit maybe just a couple of seconds

But the cost of parts and repairs between the two may be hundred percent

I've been reading about the M tax It seem that the two share a lot of parts, but the ones that aren't shared are pretty pricey.

[X5 MAN]

Originally Posted by Esdras_R

I've been reading about the M tax It seem that the two share a lot of parts, but the ones that aren't shared are pretty pricey.

And the Labor rates are double the normal X5

[zoom750]

Originally Posted by predicate_logic

I was in a similar situation about 2 years ago, and ended up buying a 2010 X5M with 117K miles on it.

Before I bought it, I paid for 3 separate car inspections from different idependent mechanics. There were only a few minor issues.

Every mechanic cautioned me that maintenance was going to be needed soon, and probably gonna be expensive since everything in the car was still original from the factory.

I decided to buy the car anyway.

I already had some money set aside for maintenance, and was OK with setting aside money for maintenance every month.

Here's a list of all the preventative matintenance I did over the past 2 years:

- replaced both turbos
- replaced 1 turbocharger water pump
- replaced all valve stem seals
- walnut blasted the intake valves
- replaced fuel injectors
- replaced vacuum pump
- replaced coolant expansion tank
- replaced CCV breather line
- replaced various hoses and clamps
- flushed various fluids (coolant, power steering, etc)
- new engine mounts
- new spark plugs
- new ignition coils
- bought 4 new tires
- performed oil change every 3K miles

All of these fixes were preventative (nothing in the car was actually broken).

In my opinion, it was 100% worth it. The car is fun to drive, and it run so smooth.

Wow. That is some serious preventative maintenance. Kudos. Were most of it done at the same time (e.g., turbos, valve stem seals, walnut blast)? With engine out?

Did you DIY or by a shop?

[predicate_logic]

Originally Posted by Esdras_R

Thanks for the reply! What I think a plus is for this one is that it is all stock and the warranty has proven to actually pay out when needed. I don't plan on modding. I plan on having a PPI from a local shop that has a good rep, there is no BMW close by to take it to for an inspection, it's a small town in Alabama that I found it at during while down here for some training

predicate_logic, how many miles do you have now? Are the turbos remove and replace or should it be done by a shop? How intensive was the valve stem seal job? cost?
I think if spaced over two years, it wouldn't be so bad.

X5 man, I don't drive 100 everywhere, but I like getting to the speed limit quickly Your cost doesn't seem nearly as high or bad as some would make it seem.

The X5M has 127K miles on it now.

I drove it a decent amount before the pandemic hit. In 2020, I worked 100% from home and stayed home almost all day everyday. I think I only ended up driving it about 500 miles total for the year, lol.

The valve stem seals were replaced by an indy BMW specialist shop because the car was eating oil (about 1 quart oil burned per 3K miles driven) and some smoke was coming out of the exhaust. They charged me $5K for the job.

I also had the shop replace the factory turbos with new Garrett turbos during the valve stem seal fix job, because of the savings in labor costs (engine was already out).

There wasn't anything wrong with the turbos other than the expected wear and tear of 10 year old factory turbos. New Garrett turbos were $1200 each.

Expensive? Yes. Worth it? Depends.... as an enthusiast who enjoys driving around in an M car? YES!

[predicate_logic]

Originally Posted by zoom750

Wow. That is some serious preventative maintenance. Kudos. Were most of it done at the same time (e.g., turbos, valve stem seals, walnut blast)? With engine out?

Did you DIY or by a shop?

Thanks - yes, it was expensive, but I planned for it ahead of time. It was all done by an indy BMW specialist shop.

I did combine many of the jobs together to save on labor costs. For example, turbos + fuel injectors + valve stem seals were all 1 job. This was an engine out job. (It would have about 2.5x the cost if I had them done as separate jobs at separate times.)

Having lurked here on the forums for a while, I know there are some mixed opinions about the valve stems seals and whether it is worth it to fix them or not. Personally, I want to try and keep this car as long as humanly possible, which is why I decided to have them replaced.

[Sophisticated Redneck]

Originally Posted by Esdras_R

Hello everyone,

Been looking for a while and it seems pretty hard to find X5M's with over 130k,

A little about myself, 33, currently stationed in NY, fly stuff for a living. I have had a fair bit of basic maintenance experience with previous vehicles. Have had Fords, Infinitis, GM's, Dodge, and even a Wrangler. Few motorcycles, most recent is a monster, which I have maintained for the past few years.

I am mechanically inclined and seem to understand basic maintenance needs for an X5.

About the vehicle: It's a Red 2011 with 130K. Bought by a dealership owner from the second owner who had it since 2012 up to about 110k. He has receipts for work from a BMW dealer for about 11k worth of work in the past 4 months. Work includes new valve cover gaskets, oil pan seal, oil pump seal, new transfer case, new water pump and seal, and a new set of rear run flats. He's been driving it from about 110k until now at 130k. All his work was covered by a warranty that he sells though his dealership. I would also get a new policy starting from the date of purchase for 3 years/36k for power train, electrical, and drive assembly from ASC warranty.

The price is 17,500

What are your thoughts? I can afford a few thousand at once for a big repair, with no issue, but would rather not spend 17k to buy and end up spending another 17k in two years for repairs. I feel confident I can do basic maintenance and upkeep including minor repairs on my own. I would just have to get back to turning wrenches, which I'm cool with
What are things I should expect to break soon? lifespan of turbos? suspension? big ticket items?

Should I just wait? go with an SRT8?

I really appreciate any help, like I said, I have spent hours looking for info on these with high miles, it's been tough.

As others have mentioned this is a complicated beast to work on. Parts really aren't to bad, its the labor that will kill you so can't recommend you get into a high mileage X5M unless you have one hell of a warranty, or you are going to work on it yourself.

The biggest problem with the n63/s63 platform are the valve stem seals, ccv system, turbo oil return, and turbo coolant lines. Minor but easy to fix issues like coils/plugs and injectors are also a factor on any engine past 100k.

While the engine compartment looks daunting, its actually logically laid out and while extremely time consuming, not too bad to work on. With that being said, a job like the valve stem seals will take the average mechanic 40-60 hours to do. I did them myself and spent well over 120+ hours as I also removed the heads to clean up all the carbon, lap the valves, and do a mild port job. I don't have a lift so had to do it all in car which greatly added to the time.

Below is a video of the valve stem seal replacement on the n63, which save for the upper intake manifolds and minor differences in the CCV lines/intercooler coolant lines, is the exact same job on the s63. If the video doesn't scare you, then go for it. If this is something you don't want to tackle yourself, then make sure you have a warranty that will cover this if you decide to buy. I was consuming 1 quart of oil every 700 miles, after valve steam seals were replaced it dropped to 1/2 a quart every 5K miles. The James Bond smoke screen I left at every stop light also stopped =). If you buy, make sure to test the truck by letting it idle for 5min, then watch for any smoke when you take off.

I am at 165K miles now, but like the other member posted, I also did alot of preventative maintenance with new injectors, coils, turbos, vacuum pump, pressure converters, cam sensors, vanos solenoids, etc. Still running 12.6 1/4 mile and 4.2 0-60, not to shabby for such a heavy high mileage beast.

[predicate_logic]

Overall, if I'm being realistic, I can't recommend buying a high mileage X5M unless one of these is true:

1) you are prepared to spend somewhere between $2-4K per year, on average, for a shop to do all the maintenance and upkeep and fixes
2) you are prepared to spend $1-2K in parts per year, on average, and able to do all the work yourself, AND you have the spare time in your life to do all the fixes yourself
3) you can do a combination of #1 and #2

Personally, I do have the money to pay a shop to maintain my X5M, but I don't have the money to buy a brand new one.

[Esdras_R]

Originally Posted by predicate_logic

Overall, if I'm being realistic, I can't recommend buying a high mileage X5M unless one of these is true:

1) you are prepared to spend somewhere between $2-4K per year, on average, for a shop to do all the maintenance and upkeep and fixes
2) you are prepared to spend $1-2K in parts per year, on average, and able to do all the work yourself, AND you have the spare time in your life to do all the fixes yourself
3) you can do a combination of #1 and #2

Personally, I do have the money to pay a shop to maintain my X5M, but I don't have the money to buy a brand new one.

That is some pretty sound logic, your X5M is beautiful by the way!
It sounds like any time that there is major work being done, as much should be thrown in to replace as possible.
I'm going to do some more research on the warranty, according to his paperwork they covered the turbos, which is one of my main concerns.
I feel like all the high mileage M's that I've seen are right at about 120K-130K which makes me a little weary.
I can most definitely do minor stuff and I actually don't mind putting in the work since it's something I enjoy as a hobby. I was looking at an SRT8 Jeep, but this seems to have some more character and seems a whole lot more fun.

[Esdras_R]

Originally Posted by Sophisticated Redneck

As others have mentioned this is a complicated beast to work on. Parts really aren't to bad, its the labor that will kill you so can't recommend you get into a high mileage X5M unless you have one hell of a warranty, or you are going to work on it yourself.

The biggest problem with the n63/s63 platform are the valve stem seals, ccv system, turbo oil return, and turbo coolant lines. Minor but easy to fix issues like coils/plugs and injectors are also a factor on any engine past 100k.

While the engine compartment looks daunting, its actually logically laid out and while extremely time consuming, not too bad to work on. With that being said, a job like the valve stem seals will take the average mechanic 40-60 hours to do. I did them myself and spent well over 120+ hours as I also removed the heads to clean up all the carbon, lap the valves, and do a mild port job. I don't have a lift so had to do it all in car which greatly added to the time.

Below is a video of the valve stem seal replacement on the n63, which save for the upper intake manifolds and minor differences in the CCV lines/intercooler coolant lines, is the exact same job on the s63. If the video doesn't scare you, then go for it. If this is something you don't want to tackle yourself, then make sure you have a warranty that will cover this if you decide to buy. I was consuming 1 quart of oil every 700 miles, after valve steam seals were replaced it dropped to 1/2 a quart every 5K miles. The James Bond smoke screen I left at every stop light also stopped =). If you buy, make sure to test the truck by letting it idle for 5min, then watch for any smoke when you take off.

I am at 165K miles now, but like the other member posted, I also did alot of preventative maintenance with new injectors, coils, turbos, vacuum pump, pressure converters, cam sensors, vanos solenoids, etc. Still running 12.6 1/4 mile and 4.2 0-60, not to shabby for such a heavy high mileage beast.

I think I saw some of your posts as I searched around the forum. Very impressive on the amount of work you're able to do, I don't think I have the mental aptitude to keep track of where it all goes once I take it apart lol

[X5 MAN]

Originally Posted by Esdras_R

I think I saw some of your posts as I searched around the forum. Very impressive on the amount of work you're able to do, I don't think I have the mental aptitude to keep track of where it all goes once I take it apart lol

I bet it is easier to do Brain surgery then working on this X5M motor

[Esdras_R]

Originally Posted by X5 MAN

I bet it is easier to do Brain surgery then working on this X5M motor

It really does look intimidating. I'm really bad at keeping track of how stuff goes back together. Label everything! some people just have the gift.

[igell]

I bought mine with 64k on it.. I now have 80k and its been mostly problem free save for a few items. In CA there are a lot of recalls that are covered by extended warranty so most of the expensive work has been covered. (turbos, driveshaft, fuel injectors, etc)
A good indy shop can do most of the work for half the dealer price.

I dont know how prices are in NY (i doubt they are higher than in N CA) but you can do better than 17k for truck with 130k. You can get one with 80k for around $22k around here. Maintenance is not any more complicated than any other X5, parts are slightly more expensive but with the amount of aftermarket parts available for e70s at this point.. there are lots of cheaper quality options.

I say keep looking and stay under 100k miles.

[bmwpower603]

Originally Posted by predicate_logic

The X5M has 127K miles on it now.

I drove it a decent amount before the pandemic hit. In 2020, I worked 100% from home and stayed home almost all day everyday. I think I only ended up driving it about 500 miles total for the year, lol.

The valve stem seals were replaced by an indy BMW specialist shop because the car was eating oil (about 1 quart oil burned per 3K miles driven) and some smoke was coming out of the exhaust. They charged me $5K for the job.

I also had the shop replace the factory turbos with new Garrett turbos during the valve stem seal fix job, because of the savings in labor costs (engine was already out).

There wasn't anything wrong with the turbos other than the expected wear and tear of 10 year old factory turbos. New Garrett turbos were $1200 each.

Expensive? Yes. Worth it? Depends.... as an enthusiast who enjoys driving around in an M car? YES!

BMW mentions that burning 1 quart of oil every 3k miles is part of normal operation. (The workshop manual might have even said its normal to burn 1qt every 1k miles)

They also recommend doing oil changes every 20k on N63 engines.

So what are we supposed to believe?

Rod bearings are not an issue on these vehicles. The ones that have suffered failure, was due to maintenance neglect, along with poor driving habits.

IIRC someone on this forums recently pulled his rod bearings, and main bearings to do a oil pump failure. The main bearings were in excellent shape. (This particular forum member installed the updated oil pump; which has a new design) He installed it preventively, and it failed a few months later.

Maintain your engine. Change the oil every 5k miles. And you'll be fine.

PS- Dont buy a x5 M without maintenance records. ( A lot of them; preferably dealership service records with every oil change )

[pearlpower]

If your willing to do work, go for it, it is an awesome performance vehicle, and tuned is a lot of fun. Mine has been dead reliable beyond the usual coils, coolant tank, ccv boots, and coolant temp sensor. Turbos are great, no smoke, shifts awesome, and surprises many folks lining up next to it. Tires are $$$ and change the oil every 5k miles, no more.

[MMMGood5]

I am the 2nd owner of a 2012 X5M currently with 116k miles of which I've owned it the last 6+ years and 75k miles. I had a 5 year warranty on it when I purchased it. Buying the warranty for around $3k was a great financial decision as I've experienced around $20k in repair bills but only paid a $100 deductible for each repair.

The biggest repair involved dropping the engine to fix the turbo lines, engine seals...etc. due to oil seepage that eventually led to minor engine compartment oil smoke.

As everyone probably knows, these engines get extremely hot and the plastics and seals don't hold up. However, if you're a fan of "M" cars, you go into with your eyes open when you buy used, realizing that you've saved considerably (10's of thousands of $) by not experiencing major, major depreciation the first 3-4 years of owning the car.

You'll pay some of that savings back with repairs, but you'll get one of the best handling, driver enthusiast (built like a bank vault solid) SUV's ever built - still to this day IMHO.

When I purchased it 6+ years ago, I test drove all the competitors at the time, e.g.; Cayenne Turbo, Range Rover Sport, Q7 S-Line (not really a competitor), ...etc. Nothing came close to the handling and feel that the X5M delivered.

It still drives wonderfully. The power, sound, and handling are terrific. I still get complements on it as many have told me it looks better (more muscular) than subsequent generations. The paint has held up incredibly well as has the interior (looks mostly new (and that's with hauling around 3 kids) except for some minor flaking of the plastic "wrap" on the drivers door handle - an easy, cheap fix).

It's my daily driver, family hauler, and interstate travel business car. It has never left me stranded. I am very pro-active on maintenance, changing the oil every 5k miles and taking care of all the other recommended maintenance, e.g.; fluids, ...etc.

Frankly, whenever I decide to sell it (ideally at least 3 years from now), I am pretty sure nothing will quite compare to it. IMHO, it's a classic M car in a SUV package. I've owned 4 other "M" cars (e46, e90, M5 and M2).

[GregWX5]

What about the rear shocks and front struts? Have you guys replaced them? I have a 2010 with 140,000 mostly Texas highway miles. I'm doing all front bushings and ball joints. Also going to install the Dinan Springs so replacing the upper and lower spring perches and shock mounts. Overall the shocks seemed ok, no signs of leaks, and the ride seemed good. But with everything taken out debating whether I should replace them.